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Mercedes just released a level 3 car. Openpilot, while primarily lane keeping, does it way better than any human can. Driving doesn’t require an advanced degr

Mercedes just released a level 3 car. Openpilot, while primarily lane keeping, does it way better than any human can. Driving doesn’t require an advanced degree in physics. It’s mostly a mish mash of fairly mundane tasks.

throw0101d 3y ago
> Driving doesn’t require an advanced degree in physics. It’s mostly a mish mash of fairly mundane tasks. Generally not wrong, but when it becomes non-mundane, it can become so in a hurry. This is why I'm sometimes skeptical about statistics that say "x% of airplane crashes are human error". Well maybe, but by the time the humans get involved the automated systems have often thrown up their proverbial hands and digitally exclaimed "Jesus take the wheel". I think having computers take over the mundane parts may help collision rates as people can get numbed and bored by the monotony. One has to be careful about having the right level of automation and control for the given situation, as per the famous "Children of the Magenta Line" presentation: * https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ESJH1NLMLs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ESJH1NLMLs > “Children of the magenta line” has become shorthand for pilots who manage and monitor systems but lack the stick-and-rudder skills to fly the airplane with authority. You may hear it wielded as an epithet in a discussion of “real pilots” versus “kids these days.” But in many cockpits today, automation illiteracy may be as dangerous as automation dependency. Vanderburgh’s insights shouldn’t drive us to reject automation altogether, but rather put it in its proper place in our pilot toolkits. Just as you should hand-fly regularly to keep your stick-and-rudder skills sharp, you should also practice using the technology available in the aircraft you fly. * https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2023/march/flight-training-magazine/always-learning-magenta-line https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2023/march/flig... * https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/children-of-the-magenta-automation-paradox-pt-1/ https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/children-of-the-magen... * https://skybrary.aero/articles/cockpit-automation-advantages-and-safety-challenges https://skybrary.aero/articles/cockpit-automation-advantages... * https://www.computer.org/csdl/magazine/sp/2015/05/msp2015050104/13rRUxASutL https://www.computer.org/csdl/magazine/sp/2015/05/msp2015050...
- svieira 3y ago
  See also _The Ironies of Automation_ by Lisanne Bainbridge [1] [1]: https://ckrybus.com/static/papers/Bainbridge_1983_Automatica.pdf https://ckrybus.com/static/papers/Bainbridge_1983_Automatica...
- chrischen 3y ago
  I definitely get numbed by the monotony even when manually driving. At the very least Openpilot beeps at me loudly if it detects I've fallen asleep.
lxgr 3y ago
I'm willing to believe that computers are better at lane keeping than humans are. That's not the only scenario, though: Unfortunately, driving can go from lane keeping to making a life-or-death decision in a second, and that's not enough time for a human hand-off. A plane's autopilot can beep and bail out to a human with a few seconds for them to get oriented and take over; a car doesn't always have that luxury. "Is this a person walking into my lane or just a shadow?" isn't a question that comes up in the air. Until a self-driving car can minimize the probability of that detection going wrong to below human thresholds, I wouldn't feel comfortable sitting in the driver (or maybe even passenger) seat of one.
- chrischen 3y ago
  We're already at a point where computer vision models are vastly superior than any human at detecting objects.
ExoticPearTree 3y ago
> Mercedes just released a level 3 car. Which only activates on roads mapped extensively by Mercedes.

throw0101d 3y ago

> Driving doesn’t require an advanced degree in physics. It’s mostly a mish mash of fairly mundane tasks. Generally not wrong, but when it becomes non-mundane, it can become so in a hurry. This is why I'm sometimes skeptical about statistics that say "x% of airplane crashes are human error". Well maybe, but by the time the humans get involved the automated systems have often thrown up their proverbial hands and digitally exclaimed "Jesus take the wheel". I think having computers take over the mundane parts may help collision rates as people can get numbed and bored by the monotony. One has to be careful about having the right level of automation and control for the given situation, as per the famous "Children of the Magenta Line" presentation: * https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ESJH1NLMLs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ESJH1NLMLs > “Children of the magenta line” has become shorthand for pilots who manage and monitor systems but lack the stick-and-rudder skills to fly the airplane with authority. You may hear it wielded as an epithet in a discussion of “real pilots” versus “kids these days.” But in many cockpits today, automation illiteracy may be as dangerous as automation dependency. Vanderburgh’s insights shouldn’t drive us to reject automation altogether, but rather put it in its proper place in our pilot toolkits. Just as you should hand-fly regularly to keep your stick-and-rudder skills sharp, you should also practice using the technology available in the aircraft you fly. * https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2023/march/flight-training-magazine/always-learning-magenta-line https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2023/march/flig... * https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/children-of-the-magenta-automation-paradox-pt-1/ https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/children-of-the-magen... * https://skybrary.aero/articles/cockpit-automation-advantages-and-safety-challenges https://skybrary.aero/articles/cockpit-automation-advantages... * https://www.computer.org/csdl/magazine/sp/2015/05/msp2015050104/13rRUxASutL https://www.computer.org/csdl/magazine/sp/2015/05/msp2015050...

svieira 3y ago
See also _The Ironies of Automation_ by Lisanne Bainbridge [1] [1]: https://ckrybus.com/static/papers/Bainbridge_1983_Automatica.pdf https://ckrybus.com/static/papers/Bainbridge_1983_Automatica...
chrischen 3y ago
I definitely get numbed by the monotony even when manually driving. At the very least Openpilot beeps at me loudly if it detects I've fallen asleep.

lxgr 3y ago

I'm willing to believe that computers are better at lane keeping than humans are. That's not the only scenario, though: Unfortunately, driving can go from lane keeping to making a life-or-death decision in a second, and that's not enough time for a human hand-off. A plane's autopilot can beep and bail out to a human with a few seconds for them to get oriented and take over; a car doesn't always have that luxury. "Is this a person walking into my lane or just a shadow?" isn't a question that comes up in the air. Until a self-driving car can minimize the probability of that detection going wrong to below human thresholds, I wouldn't feel comfortable sitting in the driver (or maybe even passenger) seat of one.

chrischen 3y ago
We're already at a point where computer vision models are vastly superior than any human at detecting objects.

ExoticPearTree 3y ago

> Mercedes just released a level 3 car. Which only activates on roads mapped extensively by Mercedes.