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So because those Zionist arguments exist, calling for the murder of Jewish people (not metaphorically, the question was a hypothetical) is something where "nuan

So because those Zionist arguments exist, calling for the murder of Jewish people (not metaphorically, the question was a hypothetical) is something where "nuance" matters now? You acknowledge the arguments as bad faith, then turn around and use them to relativize hate speech. Anyone calling for the murder of Jewish people (per the metaphorical) would never accept those arguments in the first place

wredcoll 3y ago
I was going to write a long winded reply about the differences between "hate speech" directed at "israelis" vs "jews" and how easy it is to conflate the two, especially with the constant israeli attempts to force people to treat the two as the same thing, but instead let me ask you a question: Do you honestly think that the president of harvard wishes for, hopes for, or even wants, the mass murder of jewish people all over the world? And following up on that, do you honestly believe that the students at harvard want all jewish people all over the world to be murdered? Isn't it more likely that the students in question want the israelis to stop committing acts of violence against palestinians and perhaps don't view the palestinian violence as any worse than what the israelis are doing? One thing I've noticed over the years is that it seems really easy for people who benefit from the current status quo to condemn violence meant to change the status quo. It's pretty easy to come up with restrictions for people's protests when you're not the one living in an oppressive society.
- matrix87 3y ago
  > And following up on that, do you honestly believe that the students at harvard want all jewish people all over the world to be murdered? "We, the undersigned student organizations, hold the Israeli regime entirely responsible for all unfolding violence." For the people who view Oct 7 as justified, yes > Isn't it more likely that the students in question want the israelis to stop committing acts of violence against palestinians They can want both at the same time. October 7th was an act of terror against Jewish civilians. The people who blame the Israeli government 100% (including aforementioned student organizations) don't find fault with the people committing those murders. That implies that they see the murder of Jewish people as justified punishment for the actions of the Israeli government. The choice of words is deliberate Criticizing the Israeli government and publicly stating that an act of terror is justified are two very different things, of which Harvard students know the difference

wredcoll 3y ago

I was going to write a long winded reply about the differences between "hate speech" directed at "israelis" vs "jews" and how easy it is to conflate the two, especially with the constant israeli attempts to force people to treat the two as the same thing, but instead let me ask you a question: Do you honestly think that the president of harvard wishes for, hopes for, or even wants, the mass murder of jewish people all over the world? And following up on that, do you honestly believe that the students at harvard want all jewish people all over the world to be murdered? Isn't it more likely that the students in question want the israelis to stop committing acts of violence against palestinians and perhaps don't view the palestinian violence as any worse than what the israelis are doing? One thing I've noticed over the years is that it seems really easy for people who benefit from the current status quo to condemn violence meant to change the status quo. It's pretty easy to come up with restrictions for people's protests when you're not the one living in an oppressive society.

matrix87 3y ago
> And following up on that, do you honestly believe that the students at harvard want all jewish people all over the world to be murdered? "We, the undersigned student organizations, hold the Israeli regime entirely responsible for all unfolding violence." For the people who view Oct 7 as justified, yes > Isn't it more likely that the students in question want the israelis to stop committing acts of violence against palestinians They can want both at the same time. October 7th was an act of terror against Jewish civilians. The people who blame the Israeli government 100% (including aforementioned student organizations) don't find fault with the people committing those murders. That implies that they see the murder of Jewish people as justified punishment for the actions of the Israeli government. The choice of words is deliberate Criticizing the Israeli government and publicly stating that an act of terror is justified are two very different things, of which Harvard students know the difference