4 ms·

These are fantastic art works, and driving around to check them out would a perfect euro tour for a future summer. Still I can't help but be intrigued by the wi

These are fantastic art works, and driving around to check them out would a perfect euro tour for a future summer. Still I can't help but be intrigued by the wistful tone of the website. Judging by the "about" page, the guy running it is relatively young, so he can't quite have the Yugo-nostalgia. And yet passages like > there were many in Yugoslavia who refused to fully integrate into this communist-led multi-cultural society [...] During the hey-day of Yugoslavia, this resentment and anger was very much kept in check by the Yugoslavian government's intense efforts in stamping out inter-ethnic retaliations, nationalism or religious hatred in any form, accompanied by the intense promotion of the ideals of 'Brotherhood and Unity'. — to me read like they celebrate the Yugoslav communists. Would be curious to know if it's just me, or others also share the impression.

cafard 3y ago
A neighbor got out of Yugoslavia when things fell apart. Formerly cordial neighbors burned down his family's house (near Sarajevo). He does remember favorably the Tito regime's success in keeping the peace.
zerkten 3y ago
I didn't read much of the site yet, but one way I might read your quote is as being against those who ripped the country apart after communism. I would guess that many young people see that as the last tragedy and not communism. FWIW Yugoslavia was open to tourism during the Cold War. My father drove from the UK to Dubrovnik with a friend in the 60s. I retraced part of that trip about 5 years ago. I'd have seen more had this site and book been available, but I stumbled on a few of the places on their map. Not on their map is Zeljava [1] which was an airbase with extensive underground tunnels under a mountain on the Bosnia/Croatia border. At the time, a few parts of it were cleared out with bits of spares amongst the debris. There is a UXO hazard away from worn pathways. This is highlighted by the mine signs. I think there have been a few accident since the war in the 90s, but inside there was a bigger risk from falling concrete (look up for blast door). Recent photos [2] show it has been cleaned up a lot. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%BDeljava_Air_Base https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%BDeljava_Air_Base [2] https://www.scmp.com/photos/today-photos/3238875/once-secret-cold-war-airbase-zeljava-now-tourist-attraction-croatia https://www.scmp.com/photos/today-photos/3238875/once-secret...
asta123 3y ago
Yugoslav communist party was trying to build 'Yugoslav' (South Slavic) identity and trying to suppress nationalist differences. It was more multi-cultural than today's countries in the region which were formed on these ethnic lines.
dkjaudyeqooe 3y ago
Yugoslavia, in the end, was not much different from the USSR although it was not aligned with it. It was a forced combination of different states or regions (within Yugoslavia they were called republics) that were culturally or ethnically distinct, like much of Europe, but that identity per se wasn't the issue, rather that it was a forced combination and that people were treated differently, with Serbia having a dominant role to the detriment of others. It wasn't due to a lack of "brotherly love" but more like the presence of "brotherly oppression". Some might argue with this but it's notable that a majority wanted out of Yugoslavia and Serbia was willing to use force to stop that. In my travels, those who think of the communist era as "the good old days" are usually those who had a relatively privileged position in those times and were affiliated with the communist party and often Serbian. For most people communism was an oppressive system that delivered little in the way of quality of life compared to democratic states and repressed personal freedoms. Full disclosure: I'm an ethnic Croatian.
- asta123 3y ago
  "that were culturally or ethnically distinct, like much of Europe" Other than religion I'd like to know what these cultural differences are? Serbs, Bosnians and Croats speak the same language which is very much unlike, say, French and Germans. Or even Slovak and Czechs. People of the UK are more ethnically distinct than people of former Yugoslavia.
  - samastur 3y ago
    Culture is more than language (and as Slovenian our language is different too). You don't have to spend a lot of time in Croatia, Serbia and Bosnia to be able to see that they are culturally very different. I also disagree that it was more multi-cultural than new countries are now. Possibly true at the beginning of 90s, definitely not true for Slovenia now.
    - asta123 3y ago
      Agree about Slovenia. Very different story. But the rest of the region has been dominated by nationalist politics for couple of decades whose survival depends on amplifying those national differences. And as a result cultures are now different. But don't think this was the case in former Yu (80s and earlier). As an extreme example North and South Korea are very different cultures now as a result of politics, don't think this was the case before 1950s.

cafard 3y ago

A neighbor got out of Yugoslavia when things fell apart. Formerly cordial neighbors burned down his family's house (near Sarajevo). He does remember favorably the Tito regime's success in keeping the peace.

zerkten 3y ago

I didn't read much of the site yet, but one way I might read your quote is as being against those who ripped the country apart after communism. I would guess that many young people see that as the last tragedy and not communism. FWIW Yugoslavia was open to tourism during the Cold War. My father drove from the UK to Dubrovnik with a friend in the 60s. I retraced part of that trip about 5 years ago. I'd have seen more had this site and book been available, but I stumbled on a few of the places on their map. Not on their map is Zeljava [1] which was an airbase with extensive underground tunnels under a mountain on the Bosnia/Croatia border. At the time, a few parts of it were cleared out with bits of spares amongst the debris. There is a UXO hazard away from worn pathways. This is highlighted by the mine signs. I think there have been a few accident since the war in the 90s, but inside there was a bigger risk from falling concrete (look up for blast door). Recent photos [2] show it has been cleaned up a lot. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%BDeljava_Air_Base https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%BDeljava_Air_Base [2] https://www.scmp.com/photos/today-photos/3238875/once-secret-cold-war-airbase-zeljava-now-tourist-attraction-croatia https://www.scmp.com/photos/today-photos/3238875/once-secret...

asta123 3y ago

Yugoslav communist party was trying to build 'Yugoslav' (South Slavic) identity and trying to suppress nationalist differences. It was more multi-cultural than today's countries in the region which were formed on these ethnic lines.

dkjaudyeqooe 3y ago

Yugoslavia, in the end, was not much different from the USSR although it was not aligned with it. It was a forced combination of different states or regions (within Yugoslavia they were called republics) that were culturally or ethnically distinct, like much of Europe, but that identity per se wasn't the issue, rather that it was a forced combination and that people were treated differently, with Serbia having a dominant role to the detriment of others. It wasn't due to a lack of "brotherly love" but more like the presence of "brotherly oppression". Some might argue with this but it's notable that a majority wanted out of Yugoslavia and Serbia was willing to use force to stop that. In my travels, those who think of the communist era as "the good old days" are usually those who had a relatively privileged position in those times and were affiliated with the communist party and often Serbian. For most people communism was an oppressive system that delivered little in the way of quality of life compared to democratic states and repressed personal freedoms. Full disclosure: I'm an ethnic Croatian.

asta123 3y ago
"that were culturally or ethnically distinct, like much of Europe" Other than religion I'd like to know what these cultural differences are? Serbs, Bosnians and Croats speak the same language which is very much unlike, say, French and Germans. Or even Slovak and Czechs. People of the UK are more ethnically distinct than people of former Yugoslavia.
- samastur 3y ago
  Culture is more than language (and as Slovenian our language is different too). You don't have to spend a lot of time in Croatia, Serbia and Bosnia to be able to see that they are culturally very different. I also disagree that it was more multi-cultural than new countries are now. Possibly true at the beginning of 90s, definitely not true for Slovenia now.
  - asta123 3y ago
    Agree about Slovenia. Very different story. But the rest of the region has been dominated by nationalist politics for couple of decades whose survival depends on amplifying those national differences. And as a result cultures are now different. But don't think this was the case in former Yu (80s and earlier). As an extreme example North and South Korea are very different cultures now as a result of politics, don't think this was the case before 1950s.