4 ms·

Humana is starting to hire nurses in the Philippines. One would think that’s a national security hole but what do I know. The first candidate to promise an out

Humana is starting to hire nurses in the Philippines. One would think that’s a national security hole but what do I know. The first candidate to promise an outlawing of outsourcing gets my vote.

toomuchtodo 3y ago
You don’t have to outlaw it, just make it so economically painful as to be outlawed.
- intended 3y ago
  Oh, yes please! As much as I would like labor laws to be improved Globally, I doubt governments will allow this. That said, I am dying to see some country try something similar again. There is something beautiful when voters hold politicians up to their values, and politicans fail to explain the competitive realities to their voters. Making outsourcing economically unviable is a magnicificent contender.
raincom 3y ago
Candidates can promise many things, but they won't pass laws to ban outsourcing. Even if they do, they dilute it to an extent that these laws become impotent by creative loopholes.
- pylua 3y ago
  They might if the tax base decreases substantially and unemployment shoots up to unsustainable levels. The government definitely cannot afford , with the national debt, to lose tax dollars or to subsidize high levels of unemployment.
alephnerd 3y ago
Nursing was always dependent on Pinoy labor. Because PH used to an American territory until 1946, the education system is largely the same [0]. PH is to the US Medical system as India/Pakistan/Bangladesh are to the UK NHS [0] - https://nursing.uw.edu/article/filipinos-and-filipinos-americans-nurses-in-the-united-states/ https://nursing.uw.edu/article/filipinos-and-filipinos-ameri...
- wharvle 3y ago
  Indeed, Filipinos are a big part of the US military, and someone's worried about Filipino nurses being a security threat? Hahaha. https://news.mit.edu/2020/philippines-us-military-alliance-0607 https://news.mit.edu/2020/philippines-us-military-alliance-0... But I'm not sure how well the history of the US in the Philippines is taught even in gen-ed college history classes, let alone, say, high school. One of those topics I think most folks learn about either through personal interest, or as part of a history or politics major in college, apart from maybe a passing mention when covering the tail end of 19th century US history, or maybe a low-context entry in coverage of WWII. I guess it's not as bad as mistaking Puerto Ricans for "foreigners", at least.
  - alephnerd 3y ago
    > history of the US in the Philippines is taught even in gen-ed college history classes, let alone, say, high school Depends on the state. I grew up in California, so Asian American history is extremely prominent since 1st grade.
    - wharvle 3y ago
      Ah. Plains state here. Maybe that’s to California as Native American history was to us. That, the “age of exploration”, western expansion, very bad revolutionary war history, and the “cradle of civilization” (Mesopotamia) must, collectively, have represented 95% of all our time spent on history, K-6.
zdragnar 3y ago
I'm pretty sure there's something in HIPAA or SOC 2 that ought to be preventing people outside the US from having any access at all to US patient data, but Humana likely has more lawyers who know these things than I do....
- ceejayoz 3y ago
  I'm pretty sure you're wrong. https://www.hhs.gov/hipaa/for-professionals/faq/2083/do-the-hipaa-rules-allow-a-covered-entity-or-business-associate-to-use-a-csp-that-stores-ephi-on-servers-outside-of-the-united-states/index.html https://www.hhs.gov/hipaa/for-professionals/faq/2083/do-the-...
wharvle 3y ago
We have to import medical professionals (or hire offshored ones, for telehealth or whatever) if we don't want our healthcare system to collapse. We're gonna need to do a lot more of it as the years go on, too. Too bad we can't import doctors. That's the worst bottleneck. We're all gonna spend our twilight years being cared for almost exclusively by people who speak English with a heavy accent. The ball's been rolling that way for some time and it's got enough momentum that making anything else happen will take many decades.
- cjbgkagh 3y ago
  It's like a health care ponzi scheme, what happens when the imports get old? The solution again is more imports. What about the source countries, did they not need medical professionals?
  - wharvle 3y ago
    Same thing that happens to most who aren't doing pretty damn financially well in the US, I guess? All their savings gets siphoned into the system, then they die younger than they might have, and less comfortably than they should, unless family takes very good care of them? Then debt collectors try to trick anyone connected to them into paying for medical & other debts they aren't responsible for? The usual. Anyway, worker visas don't have to be a path to citizenship, so this may fall, for better or worse, under "not our problem", depending on how it's all structured.
    - cjbgkagh 3y ago
      Which visa is that for the US? The ones I looked at are dual intent. I'm more familiar with the UK (NHS) where imports are expected to stay. I'm also pretty sure that the dual intent is part of the ability to pay under market rates where the immigration potential is a fringe benefit captured by the employer. Honestly when the current crop of adults from the 'healthy at any size' era get old it's going to be a medical shit show, I'm pretty sure governments will end up resorting to Canadian style MAID for the poor, sick, and old as no-one will have the money for proper care.
otikik 3y ago
I don’t think outsourcing is the main problem with the American healthcare system. I encourage you to go a bit deeper and to not give your vote on a single bit of info. Try to expand to 1Kb.
pc86 3y ago
What do you think nurses do that having Filippino nurses would be a national security hole?

Humana is starting to hire nurses in the Philippines. One would think that’s a national security hole but what do I know. The first candidate to promise an outlawing of outsourcing gets my vote.

toomuchtodo 3y ago

You don’t have to outlaw it, just make it so economically painful as to be outlawed.

intended 3y ago
Oh, yes please! As much as I would like labor laws to be improved Globally, I doubt governments will allow this. That said, I am dying to see some country try something similar again. There is something beautiful when voters hold politicians up to their values, and politicans fail to explain the competitive realities to their voters. Making outsourcing economically unviable is a magnicificent contender.

raincom 3y ago

Candidates can promise many things, but they won't pass laws to ban outsourcing. Even if they do, they dilute it to an extent that these laws become impotent by creative loopholes.

pylua 3y ago
They might if the tax base decreases substantially and unemployment shoots up to unsustainable levels. The government definitely cannot afford , with the national debt, to lose tax dollars or to subsidize high levels of unemployment.

alephnerd 3y ago

Nursing was always dependent on Pinoy labor. Because PH used to an American territory until 1946, the education system is largely the same [0]. PH is to the US Medical system as India/Pakistan/Bangladesh are to the UK NHS [0] - https://nursing.uw.edu/article/filipinos-and-filipinos-americans-nurses-in-the-united-states/ https://nursing.uw.edu/article/filipinos-and-filipinos-ameri...

wharvle 3y ago
Indeed, Filipinos are a big part of the US military, and someone's worried about Filipino nurses being a security threat? Hahaha. https://news.mit.edu/2020/philippines-us-military-alliance-0607 https://news.mit.edu/2020/philippines-us-military-alliance-0... But I'm not sure how well the history of the US in the Philippines is taught even in gen-ed college history classes, let alone, say, high school. One of those topics I think most folks learn about either through personal interest, or as part of a history or politics major in college, apart from maybe a passing mention when covering the tail end of 19th century US history, or maybe a low-context entry in coverage of WWII. I guess it's not as bad as mistaking Puerto Ricans for "foreigners", at least.
- alephnerd 3y ago
  > history of the US in the Philippines is taught even in gen-ed college history classes, let alone, say, high school Depends on the state. I grew up in California, so Asian American history is extremely prominent since 1st grade.
  - wharvle 3y ago
    Ah. Plains state here. Maybe that’s to California as Native American history was to us. That, the “age of exploration”, western expansion, very bad revolutionary war history, and the “cradle of civilization” (Mesopotamia) must, collectively, have represented 95% of all our time spent on history, K-6.

zdragnar 3y ago

I'm pretty sure there's something in HIPAA or SOC 2 that ought to be preventing people outside the US from having any access at all to US patient data, but Humana likely has more lawyers who know these things than I do....

ceejayoz 3y ago
I'm pretty sure you're wrong. https://www.hhs.gov/hipaa/for-professionals/faq/2083/do-the-hipaa-rules-allow-a-covered-entity-or-business-associate-to-use-a-csp-that-stores-ephi-on-servers-outside-of-the-united-states/index.html https://www.hhs.gov/hipaa/for-professionals/faq/2083/do-the-...

wharvle 3y ago

We have to import medical professionals (or hire offshored ones, for telehealth or whatever) if we don't want our healthcare system to collapse. We're gonna need to do a lot more of it as the years go on, too. Too bad we can't import doctors. That's the worst bottleneck. We're all gonna spend our twilight years being cared for almost exclusively by people who speak English with a heavy accent. The ball's been rolling that way for some time and it's got enough momentum that making anything else happen will take many decades.

cjbgkagh 3y ago
It's like a health care ponzi scheme, what happens when the imports get old? The solution again is more imports. What about the source countries, did they not need medical professionals?
- wharvle 3y ago
  Same thing that happens to most who aren't doing pretty damn financially well in the US, I guess? All their savings gets siphoned into the system, then they die younger than they might have, and less comfortably than they should, unless family takes very good care of them? Then debt collectors try to trick anyone connected to them into paying for medical & other debts they aren't responsible for? The usual. Anyway, worker visas don't have to be a path to citizenship, so this may fall, for better or worse, under "not our problem", depending on how it's all structured.
  - cjbgkagh 3y ago
    Which visa is that for the US? The ones I looked at are dual intent. I'm more familiar with the UK (NHS) where imports are expected to stay. I'm also pretty sure that the dual intent is part of the ability to pay under market rates where the immigration potential is a fringe benefit captured by the employer. Honestly when the current crop of adults from the 'healthy at any size' era get old it's going to be a medical shit show, I'm pretty sure governments will end up resorting to Canadian style MAID for the poor, sick, and old as no-one will have the money for proper care.

otikik 3y ago

I don’t think outsourcing is the main problem with the American healthcare system. I encourage you to go a bit deeper and to not give your vote on a single bit of info. Try to expand to 1Kb.

pc86 3y ago

What do you think nurses do that having Filippino nurses would be a national security hole?