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Speak for yourself. People who make their living in (actually) creative fields don’t have the luxury. We’ll see how all the brogrammers feel about industrial sc

Speak for yourself. People who make their living in (actually) creative fields don’t have the luxury. We’ll see how all the brogrammers feel about industrial scale plagiarism 5 years from now when Gen AI models code better than any human.

feyman_r 3y ago
Isn’t this the case already with the Industrial Revolution where we began mass-producing (mostly) better day-to-day utility items rather than getting from a specific craftsman? I’d think that the clothing industry went through something similar already.
junon 3y ago
I'm in an "(actually) creative" field, not a brogrammer, 20 years of writing code, and have a vastly different opinion than you do.
- WalterBright 3y ago
  I've been writing code professionally for about 45 years now. People have cribbed my code and ideas since the beginning. At some point, I just stopped caring about it. I no longer sell code, just my services. I did have one case where someone stole my code, and then tried to sue me for copyright infringement. Too bad for him that I had a registered copyright on it :-)
- miguelazo 3y ago
  As do many “creatives” who don’t understand the technology, much less the endgame of those who will control it.
  - junon 3y ago
    Sorry do we know each other? I understand the technology fine.
    - miguelazo 3y ago
      No, just noting that you are in good company.
yunwal 3y ago
I think a substantial number of us don’t care or are happy to see it. It’s just another level of abstraction to work with. I think some artists feel the same although I understand those who don’t.
michaelmrose 3y ago
Presumably the "brogrammer" will still be the one feeding data into the model and stitching together the code it produces, vetting it, and deploying it because it is going to be massively more effective to have him do it vs the manager whose area of expertise is managing people and finance. This will drastically increase the total output of all the "brogrammers" maybe even enough to replace some of the spagetti code out there with more reliable work.
WalterBright 3y ago
Human progress has always been about building upon and extending the work of others. Besides, AI only produces a sort of "average" of what is already out there. Is it really creative work to produce an equivalent of that average? I remember when the "typing pool" was a thing. Word processors utterly destroyed that category of work, as well as the jobs for typesetting and layout, back in the 1980s.
- extractionmech 3y ago
  I would argue that the analogy rests on an incomplete consideration of the dimensions of the matter. Such tools amplified a worker’s inherent utility. The name given to the new tool reflects its nature: processor of words. Whose words? The typist. “Other peoples’ words processor” vs “word processor”. More generally, AI introduces yet another systemic mechanism for wealth extraction by the wealthy. The wealth here is creative power of the !wealthy. More sinister than the grand larceny by a thousand minor borrowings is the fact that meaning, ideals, motivating energy to move masses is taken away from the candidate pool — anyone of us can be the next demagogue, it’s not too late yet — which may include genuine thought leaders are going to be buried by the electric demagogue working for the proverbial man. “We need to hire more copyrighters for our propaganda using these ‘word processors’” becomes “Who could resist the onslaught of “our” creative efforts? Surrender now Dorothy.” tldr: Humanity has reached the absolute limit of the utility of ancient means of governance. New technology demands that we comprehensively review socio-economic order in society. Failure to do so will gift the current “winning” players in the ‘zero-sum-game’ of the du jour regime near guarantee of perpetual habitation in their very very special social perch. “Think of the children”
  - WalterBright 3y ago
    In the 1800's Germany started behind Britain and raced ahead of it in industrial might. One factor in this was Germany did not recognize copyrights. Printers went looking for something, anything, to print and printed up a storm of technical literature that enabled this rapid industrialization and the increase in wealth of its ordinary citizens.

feyman_r 3y ago

Isn’t this the case already with the Industrial Revolution where we began mass-producing (mostly) better day-to-day utility items rather than getting from a specific craftsman? I’d think that the clothing industry went through something similar already.

junon 3y ago

I'm in an "(actually) creative" field, not a brogrammer, 20 years of writing code, and have a vastly different opinion than you do.

WalterBright 3y ago
I've been writing code professionally for about 45 years now. People have cribbed my code and ideas since the beginning. At some point, I just stopped caring about it. I no longer sell code, just my services. I did have one case where someone stole my code, and then tried to sue me for copyright infringement. Too bad for him that I had a registered copyright on it :-)
miguelazo 3y ago
As do many “creatives” who don’t understand the technology, much less the endgame of those who will control it.
- junon 3y ago
  Sorry do we know each other? I understand the technology fine.
  - miguelazo 3y ago
    No, just noting that you are in good company.

yunwal 3y ago

I think a substantial number of us don’t care or are happy to see it. It’s just another level of abstraction to work with. I think some artists feel the same although I understand those who don’t.

michaelmrose 3y ago

Presumably the "brogrammer" will still be the one feeding data into the model and stitching together the code it produces, vetting it, and deploying it because it is going to be massively more effective to have him do it vs the manager whose area of expertise is managing people and finance. This will drastically increase the total output of all the "brogrammers" maybe even enough to replace some of the spagetti code out there with more reliable work.

WalterBright 3y ago

Human progress has always been about building upon and extending the work of others. Besides, AI only produces a sort of "average" of what is already out there. Is it really creative work to produce an equivalent of that average? I remember when the "typing pool" was a thing. Word processors utterly destroyed that category of work, as well as the jobs for typesetting and layout, back in the 1980s.

extractionmech 3y ago
I would argue that the analogy rests on an incomplete consideration of the dimensions of the matter. Such tools amplified a worker’s inherent utility. The name given to the new tool reflects its nature: processor of words. Whose words? The typist. “Other peoples’ words processor” vs “word processor”. More generally, AI introduces yet another systemic mechanism for wealth extraction by the wealthy. The wealth here is creative power of the !wealthy. More sinister than the grand larceny by a thousand minor borrowings is the fact that meaning, ideals, motivating energy to move masses is taken away from the candidate pool — anyone of us can be the next demagogue, it’s not too late yet — which may include genuine thought leaders are going to be buried by the electric demagogue working for the proverbial man. “We need to hire more copyrighters for our propaganda using these ‘word processors’” becomes “Who could resist the onslaught of “our” creative efforts? Surrender now Dorothy.” tldr: Humanity has reached the absolute limit of the utility of ancient means of governance. New technology demands that we comprehensively review socio-economic order in society. Failure to do so will gift the current “winning” players in the ‘zero-sum-game’ of the du jour regime near guarantee of perpetual habitation in their very very special social perch. “Think of the children”
- WalterBright 3y ago
  In the 1800's Germany started behind Britain and raced ahead of it in industrial might. One factor in this was Germany did not recognize copyrights. Printers went looking for something, anything, to print and printed up a storm of technical literature that enabled this rapid industrialization and the increase in wealth of its ordinary citizens.