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How much active fighting troops do NATO countries have in Ukraine, exactly? You need those to be counted a belligerent in a conflict.

by hef19898 3y ago

mikeyouse 3y ago
It’s utterly bizarre that people keep insisting the US is fighting a war given we have zero troops and zero military hardware committed there.. Ukraine has destroyed hundreds of armored units and multiple $billion naval ships with literal 25-yr old weapons… all the fear of WWIII is premised on the US actually engaging since the Russians would suffer immediate and massive losses and the only way to save face would be to go nuclear.
- Qwertious 3y ago
  >and zero military hardware committed there.. Where'd those Bradleys come from, then? Zero troops yes, but the US has absolutely shipped a ton of military hardware to Ukraine. Ukraine would absolutely fold without the inflow of NATO military hardware, that's the crux of Russia's strategy for winning - hope it can undermine Western support for a Ukraine war, and then crush Ukraine once they're on their own. That's the entire reason why Russia blocked gas exports to Europe - they lost a lot of gas profits forcing the EU to choose between supporting Ukraine or having Russian gas for the winter. The US itself isn't fighting in the war, but they're undeniably a key participant in it. With military hardware and training and intel support and money.
  - hef19898 3y ago
    The US, like all other NATO members, shipped a ton of hardware to Ukraine. None of that hardware is operated by NATO personel, under NATO flag so. Hence, NATO is not an active participant in the war in Ukraine, despite being arms, ammunition and intelligence suppliers as well as close allies of Ukraine. And yes, those details matter in geopolitics, a lot.
scotty79 3y ago
Formalities don't matter for image. And that's what US is about to lose completely. Do you think that China will say, but NATO soldiers didn't really fight? Modern war is supposedly all about equipment and ammunition. And NATO can't even afford proxy war against enemy fighting with heaps of junk apparently.

How much active fighting troops do NATO countries have in Ukraine, exactly? You need those to be counted a belligerent in a conflict.

mikeyouse 3y ago

It’s utterly bizarre that people keep insisting the US is fighting a war given we have zero troops and zero military hardware committed there.. Ukraine has destroyed hundreds of armored units and multiple $billion naval ships with literal 25-yr old weapons… all the fear of WWIII is premised on the US actually engaging since the Russians would suffer immediate and massive losses and the only way to save face would be to go nuclear.

Qwertious 3y ago
>and zero military hardware committed there.. Where'd those Bradleys come from, then? Zero troops yes, but the US has absolutely shipped a ton of military hardware to Ukraine. Ukraine would absolutely fold without the inflow of NATO military hardware, that's the crux of Russia's strategy for winning - hope it can undermine Western support for a Ukraine war, and then crush Ukraine once they're on their own. That's the entire reason why Russia blocked gas exports to Europe - they lost a lot of gas profits forcing the EU to choose between supporting Ukraine or having Russian gas for the winter. The US itself isn't fighting in the war, but they're undeniably a key participant in it. With military hardware and training and intel support and money.
- hef19898 3y ago
  The US, like all other NATO members, shipped a ton of hardware to Ukraine. None of that hardware is operated by NATO personel, under NATO flag so. Hence, NATO is not an active participant in the war in Ukraine, despite being arms, ammunition and intelligence suppliers as well as close allies of Ukraine. And yes, those details matter in geopolitics, a lot.

scotty79 3y ago

Formalities don't matter for image. And that's what US is about to lose completely. Do you think that China will say, but NATO soldiers didn't really fight? Modern war is supposedly all about equipment and ammunition. And NATO can't even afford proxy war against enemy fighting with heaps of junk apparently.