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Why do you need natural gas in that mix at all?

JumpCrisscross 3y ago
> Why do you need natural gas in that mix at all? It’s cleaner than the alternatives and has its distribution infrastructure already built. While waiting for more solar, or waiting for more solar and wind and nukes, those coal and oil plants are still burning.
peterfirefly 3y ago
We don't need it -- or wind and solar -- if we have enough nuclear. We are very far from having enough nuclear.
laszlojamf 3y ago
I think the parent was thinking of the US. There, natural gas is an abundant predictable, and cheap base energy source. Not so much in Europe. In Sweden the mix is nuclear, water, and the rest, but we're still suffering from the rest of Europe not having a cheap base alternative, since the markets are interconnected. Europe would _love_ to have it's own natural gas source right about now.
- peterfirefly 3y ago
  > Europe would _love_ to have it's own natural gas source right about now. And yet... the Netherlands closed down the Groningen gas field because the green voters wanted it and because they showed a few slightly cracked walls on a few houses on TV and claimed it was because of the gas field (and not because of shoddy foundations and poor construction). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groningen_gas_field https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groningen_gas_field We also could have been doing fracking on land. Maybe in the future? https://www.investigate-europe.eu/posts/europes-energy-crisis-is-reviving-the-fracking-industry https://www.investigate-europe.eu/posts/europes-energy-crisi... (2.9 on the Richter scale isn't much.) And the biggest Danish gas field in the North Sea is still down due to the old off-shore facilities being scrapped and new ones being built. This is done by TotalEnergies and should have been completed more than a year ago. It was delayed by Covid-19 but should then have been completed by summer this year. It is still not complete :( High expectations from TotalEnergies: https://totalenergies.com/projects/gas/tyra-major-offshore-project-core-our-climate-strategy https://totalenergies.com/projects/gas/tyra-major-offshore-p... Danish realities: https://energinet.dk/gas/forsyningssikkerhed/tyra/ https://energinet.dk/gas/forsyningssikkerhed/tyra/ The last platform was only put in place in October 2022 (and there was still lots of work to do): https://energiwatch.dk/Energinyt/Olie___Gas/article14460490.ece https://energiwatch.dk/Energinyt/Olie___Gas/article14460490....

> Why do you need natural gas in that mix at all? It’s cleaner than the alternatives and has its distribution infrastructure already built. While waiting for more solar, or waiting for more solar and wind and nukes, those coal and oil plants are still burning.

peterfirefly 3y ago

We don't need it -- or wind and solar -- if we have enough nuclear. We are very far from having enough nuclear.

laszlojamf 3y ago

I think the parent was thinking of the US. There, natural gas is an abundant predictable, and cheap base energy source. Not so much in Europe. In Sweden the mix is nuclear, water, and the rest, but we're still suffering from the rest of Europe not having a cheap base alternative, since the markets are interconnected. Europe would _love_ to have it's own natural gas source right about now.

peterfirefly 3y ago
> Europe would _love_ to have it's own natural gas source right about now. And yet... the Netherlands closed down the Groningen gas field because the green voters wanted it and because they showed a few slightly cracked walls on a few houses on TV and claimed it was because of the gas field (and not because of shoddy foundations and poor construction). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groningen_gas_field https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groningen_gas_field We also could have been doing fracking on land. Maybe in the future? https://www.investigate-europe.eu/posts/europes-energy-crisis-is-reviving-the-fracking-industry https://www.investigate-europe.eu/posts/europes-energy-crisi... (2.9 on the Richter scale isn't much.) And the biggest Danish gas field in the North Sea is still down due to the old off-shore facilities being scrapped and new ones being built. This is done by TotalEnergies and should have been completed more than a year ago. It was delayed by Covid-19 but should then have been completed by summer this year. It is still not complete :( High expectations from TotalEnergies: https://totalenergies.com/projects/gas/tyra-major-offshore-project-core-our-climate-strategy https://totalenergies.com/projects/gas/tyra-major-offshore-p... Danish realities: https://energinet.dk/gas/forsyningssikkerhed/tyra/ https://energinet.dk/gas/forsyningssikkerhed/tyra/ The last platform was only put in place in October 2022 (and there was still lots of work to do): https://energiwatch.dk/Energinyt/Olie___Gas/article14460490.ece https://energiwatch.dk/Energinyt/Olie___Gas/article14460490....