4 ms·

Sounds like a fair trade for both partners

by nwoli 3y ago

nicbou 3y ago
Is it? As a digital nomad (well... a potential one) these visas are great, but they don't let me do anything I couldn't do on a tourist visa. Of course it's a lot more advantageous if you're not a privileged national. But what's in it for the Korean people? They get a small number of relatively wealthy visitors who use housing and infrastructure but don't pay taxes. They likely spend less than other tourists, and use more resources. In Germany, the freelance visa requires "local economic interest", which translates to having German clients or a reason to work from Germany. Digital nomad visas seem to want the opposite.
- mathverse 3y ago
  Korea is a consumerist society where economic activity is stimulated by massive consumption. It works differently than Germany for example.
  - FredPret 3y ago
    I'd like to see the numbers on that - Korea produces lots and lots of widgets.
    - mathverse 3y ago
      I was answering the question wha's in it for Korean people. Couple of wealthy nomads are not a drain for korean economy instead they benefit the people as 2/3 of koreans are self employed and will greatly benefit from increased consumption.
- kevinmchugh 3y ago
  Can you work on a tourist visa? Obviously nobody's going to know if you get on zoom, but official sanction to work in country seems like a distinction. Additionally with their population trendline I can imagine that Korea will be happy to have even more tourists, especially ones who stay longer. Residents are maybe preferable but I don't know that they're mutually exclusive
  - KMag 3y ago
    It's highly country- and work- dependent. I work in a highly regulated industry (finance), where employers are very sensitive about remoting in from other jurisdictions. Under my previous employer, I wasn't allowed to remote in from Thailand under a tourist visa, but (pre-full-invasion) I was allowed to remote in from Ukraine on a tourist visa as long as I went nowhere near Crimea or the Donbas. (I requested official clarification about remote work on a tourist visa in Ukraine, and got back a somewhat bemused response basically "Why on earth would we care, as long as your work is fully remote and you get out within 90 days? Did I miss some detail that would make us at all interested?") Plenty of people in Thailand do illegally work fully remotely on tourist visas, and the government seems to turn a blind eye at present, as long as nobody is causing trouble. I looked into Thailand's digital nomad visa, but it would have required my employer to have a presence in Thailand. My employer at the time had no employees in Thailand, and apparently my employer's P.O. Box in Bangkok wasn't sufficient for a nomad visa. I had enough seniority at my previous company that they might have considered sub-contracting my work out to me via a Thai company owned by my wife, but it would have required pulling in a lot of favors and probably getting some partner-level approvals.
  - nicbou 3y ago
    Not really but everyone does. I mean what's the difference between a tourist with a laptop and a digital nomad? If you have no local clients, no local space and you officially reside elsewhere, it doesn't really matter. Staying longer only makes sense if you grow economic roots too. You can't have a village with only digital nomads. Their taxes don't build bridges or create a community.
    - wdb 3y ago
      Tourist visa is not meant for working?
      - kevinmchugh 3y ago
        If you're at customs and asked what your plans in the country are, you should not say "work", unless you are authorized to work in the country.
- nikanj 3y ago
  They let you work in the country legally. Working on a tourist visa is not allowed outside a handful of exceptions, and most digital nomads just hope to not get caught
- Closi 3y ago
  One obvious advantage would be the length of time you can stay in the country. For Korea obviously the advantages are the same as tourism.
- plexman 3y ago
  > but don't pay taxes most goods have VAT there, so this is not entirely true, i guess you mean income tax.
- huimang 3y ago
  2 years is huge. Being legitimately there is huge. 1. Right now you can be a "tourist" and have to leave/re-enter every 3 months. So things like renting an apartment for a year become out of the question, since SK could arbitrarily not let you re-enter. So you're stuck with the whims of hostel / airbnb owners. 2. Being a "tourist", you can't open a bank account or get a legit phone number. So you can't verify on Naver, which means you can't do things like book appointments for businesses that use Naver (which a lot of them do). You can't use KakaoPay without it either, so exchanging money with South Koreans means resorting to bitcoin which is just tedious.
  - petre 3y ago
    Renting an apartment in Korea usually requires a consistent deposit (which you get back when you leave).
- rjh29 3y ago
  I can only speak for Japan but it makes a huge difference being able to rent an apartment for a year for a fraction of a price of hotels/airbnb, and also get a proper Japanese phone number which is practically a requirement for all kinds of interactions here. Not to mention having a full year instead of having to do a visa run every 3 months and risk being rejected.
  - nicbou 3y ago
    This is very good insight, thank you

Sounds like a fair trade for both partners

by nwoli 3y ago

Sounds like a fair trade for both partners

Is it? As a digital nomad (well... a potential one) these visas are great, but they don't let me do anything I couldn't do on a tourist visa. Of course it's a lot more advantageous if you're not a privileged national. But what's in it for the Korean people? They get a small number of relatively wealthy visitors who use housing and infrastructure but don't pay taxes. They likely spend less than other tourists, and use more resources. In Germany, the freelance visa requires "local economic interest", which translates to having German clients or a reason to work from Germany. Digital nomad visas seem to want the opposite.

mathverse 3y ago
Korea is a consumerist society where economic activity is stimulated by massive consumption. It works differently than Germany for example.
- FredPret 3y ago
  I'd like to see the numbers on that - Korea produces lots and lots of widgets.
  - mathverse 3y ago
    I was answering the question wha's in it for Korean people. Couple of wealthy nomads are not a drain for korean economy instead they benefit the people as 2/3 of koreans are self employed and will greatly benefit from increased consumption.
kevinmchugh 3y ago
Can you work on a tourist visa? Obviously nobody's going to know if you get on zoom, but official sanction to work in country seems like a distinction. Additionally with their population trendline I can imagine that Korea will be happy to have even more tourists, especially ones who stay longer. Residents are maybe preferable but I don't know that they're mutually exclusive
- KMag 3y ago
  It's highly country- and work- dependent. I work in a highly regulated industry (finance), where employers are very sensitive about remoting in from other jurisdictions. Under my previous employer, I wasn't allowed to remote in from Thailand under a tourist visa, but (pre-full-invasion) I was allowed to remote in from Ukraine on a tourist visa as long as I went nowhere near Crimea or the Donbas. (I requested official clarification about remote work on a tourist visa in Ukraine, and got back a somewhat bemused response basically "Why on earth would we care, as long as your work is fully remote and you get out within 90 days? Did I miss some detail that would make us at all interested?") Plenty of people in Thailand do illegally work fully remotely on tourist visas, and the government seems to turn a blind eye at present, as long as nobody is causing trouble. I looked into Thailand's digital nomad visa, but it would have required my employer to have a presence in Thailand. My employer at the time had no employees in Thailand, and apparently my employer's P.O. Box in Bangkok wasn't sufficient for a nomad visa. I had enough seniority at my previous company that they might have considered sub-contracting my work out to me via a Thai company owned by my wife, but it would have required pulling in a lot of favors and probably getting some partner-level approvals.
- nicbou 3y ago
  Not really but everyone does. I mean what's the difference between a tourist with a laptop and a digital nomad? If you have no local clients, no local space and you officially reside elsewhere, it doesn't really matter. Staying longer only makes sense if you grow economic roots too. You can't have a village with only digital nomads. Their taxes don't build bridges or create a community.
  - wdb 3y ago
    Tourist visa is not meant for working?
    - kevinmchugh 3y ago
      If you're at customs and asked what your plans in the country are, you should not say "work", unless you are authorized to work in the country.
nikanj 3y ago
They let you work in the country legally. Working on a tourist visa is not allowed outside a handful of exceptions, and most digital nomads just hope to not get caught
Closi 3y ago
One obvious advantage would be the length of time you can stay in the country. For Korea obviously the advantages are the same as tourism.
plexman 3y ago
> but don't pay taxes most goods have VAT there, so this is not entirely true, i guess you mean income tax.
huimang 3y ago
2 years is huge. Being legitimately there is huge. 1. Right now you can be a "tourist" and have to leave/re-enter every 3 months. So things like renting an apartment for a year become out of the question, since SK could arbitrarily not let you re-enter. So you're stuck with the whims of hostel / airbnb owners. 2. Being a "tourist", you can't open a bank account or get a legit phone number. So you can't verify on Naver, which means you can't do things like book appointments for businesses that use Naver (which a lot of them do). You can't use KakaoPay without it either, so exchanging money with South Koreans means resorting to bitcoin which is just tedious.
- petre 3y ago
  Renting an apartment in Korea usually requires a consistent deposit (which you get back when you leave).
rjh29 3y ago
I can only speak for Japan but it makes a huge difference being able to rent an apartment for a year for a fraction of a price of hotels/airbnb, and also get a proper Japanese phone number which is practically a requirement for all kinds of interactions here. Not to mention having a full year instead of having to do a visa run every 3 months and risk being rejected.
- nicbou 3y ago
  This is very good insight, thank you