4 ms·

Suit claims that GPT reproduced passages from NYT almost verbatim.

rvz 3y ago
Precisely. This tired 'fair use' excuses from AI bros whilst the GPT has reproduced the article text verbatim, word for word and it being monetized without the permission from the copyright holder and source (NYT) is an obvious copyright violation 101. Full stop. Again, just like Getty v. Stability, this copyright lawsuit will end in a licensing deal. Apple played it smart with their choice with licensing deals to train their GPT [0]. But this time, OpenAI knew they could get a license to train on NYT articles but chose not to. [0] https://9to5mac.com/2023/12/22/apple-wants-to-train-its-ai-with-50-million-worth-of-licensed-news-articles/ https://9to5mac.com/2023/12/22/apple-wants-to-train-its-ai-w...
- chatmasta 3y ago
  > AI bros What (or whom) do you consider to be an "AI bro?" This sort of ad hominem generalization usually accompanies a weak argument.
  - satvikpendem 3y ago
    It seems to be used by people who've previously used the term "tech bro."
  - irq 3y ago
    Not saying I agree with this labeling, but it means approximately the same thing as “crypto bro”, but for AI
  - beau_g 3y ago
    Young males that wear Tensorflow branded muscle tank tops and drive Mitsubishi Eclipse convertibles with the vanity plate OVERFIT. They are everywhere these days.
    - jakderrida 3y ago
      Thank you for the absurd visual. The vanity plate, especially, was worth saving for last. Somehow, the car is well suited, also. Love how they prefer Tensorflow over Pytorch, too.
    - danielbln 3y ago
      https://i.imgur.com/4tF7q8M.jpg https://i.imgur.com/4tF7q8M.jpg
      - vidarh 3y ago
        The text generation is getting quite decent. The limbs disappearing into the car are somewhat less impressive.
  - vidarh 3y ago
    I generally tend to downvote comments that use "x bros" for pretty much any x on sight for that reason. It's exceedingly rare for such a comment to be much more than a thinly veiled insult with little substance. Sometimes I might even agree with the insult, but it's still rarely appropriate here.
- throwup238 3y ago
  The four factors considered in a fair use test: the purpose and character of the use the nature of the copyrighted work the amount and substantiality of the portion taken the effect of the use upon the potential market. Literally every single one of these factors has very complicated precedent and each one is an open question when it comes to AI. Since fair use is a balancing test this could go any way. Stability took the easy way out because they didn't have billions of dollars to play around with and Microsoft to back them. Let's see what OpenAI does but calling everyone who disagrees with your naive interpretation of fair use "AI bros" is doing everyone a disservice.
dahart 3y ago
I don’t doubt it does. It’s easy to get it to spit out long answers from Stack Overflow verbatim, I’ve done it. Maybe some of the “transformative” nature of the LLM output is the removal of any authorship, copyright, license, and edit history information. ;) The point here is to supplant Google as the portal of information, right? It doesn’t have new information, but it’s pretty good at remixing the words from multiple sources, when it has multiple sources. One possible reason for their legal woes wrt copyright is that it’s also great at memorizing things that only have one source. My college Markov-chain text predictor would do the same thing and easily get stuck in local regions if it couldn’t match something else.
- __loam 3y ago
  I don't think these can replace search engines.
lodovic 3y ago
I'm sure the NYT uses dictionaries, encyclopaedias and style books verbatim as well. And they don't invent the facts they write about. As journalists they are compiling and passing along other knowledge. You usually don't get a piece of their income when a journalist quotes you verbatim (people usually don't get paid for interviews).
- madeofpalk 3y ago
  If the NYT reproduces other content verbatim too much, it will get in trouble.
- threeseed 3y ago
  NYT doesn't reproduce the contents of the dictionary or encyclopaedia. And even if they did it will be fine because those sources allow for it. The point is that OpenAI never asked NYT for permission to use their data.

rvz 3y ago

Precisely. This tired 'fair use' excuses from AI bros whilst the GPT has reproduced the article text verbatim, word for word and it being monetized without the permission from the copyright holder and source (NYT) is an obvious copyright violation 101. Full stop. Again, just like Getty v. Stability, this copyright lawsuit will end in a licensing deal. Apple played it smart with their choice with licensing deals to train their GPT [0]. But this time, OpenAI knew they could get a license to train on NYT articles but chose not to. [0] https://9to5mac.com/2023/12/22/apple-wants-to-train-its-ai-with-50-million-worth-of-licensed-news-articles/ https://9to5mac.com/2023/12/22/apple-wants-to-train-its-ai-w...

chatmasta 3y ago
> AI bros What (or whom) do you consider to be an "AI bro?" This sort of ad hominem generalization usually accompanies a weak argument.
- satvikpendem 3y ago
  It seems to be used by people who've previously used the term "tech bro."
- irq 3y ago
  Not saying I agree with this labeling, but it means approximately the same thing as “crypto bro”, but for AI
- beau_g 3y ago
  Young males that wear Tensorflow branded muscle tank tops and drive Mitsubishi Eclipse convertibles with the vanity plate OVERFIT. They are everywhere these days.
  - jakderrida 3y ago
    Thank you for the absurd visual. The vanity plate, especially, was worth saving for last. Somehow, the car is well suited, also. Love how they prefer Tensorflow over Pytorch, too.
  - danielbln 3y ago
    https://i.imgur.com/4tF7q8M.jpg https://i.imgur.com/4tF7q8M.jpg
    - vidarh 3y ago
      The text generation is getting quite decent. The limbs disappearing into the car are somewhat less impressive.
- vidarh 3y ago
  I generally tend to downvote comments that use "x bros" for pretty much any x on sight for that reason. It's exceedingly rare for such a comment to be much more than a thinly veiled insult with little substance. Sometimes I might even agree with the insult, but it's still rarely appropriate here.
throwup238 3y ago
The four factors considered in a fair use test: the purpose and character of the use the nature of the copyrighted work the amount and substantiality of the portion taken the effect of the use upon the potential market. Literally every single one of these factors has very complicated precedent and each one is an open question when it comes to AI. Since fair use is a balancing test this could go any way. Stability took the easy way out because they didn't have billions of dollars to play around with and Microsoft to back them. Let's see what OpenAI does but calling everyone who disagrees with your naive interpretation of fair use "AI bros" is doing everyone a disservice.

dahart 3y ago

I don’t doubt it does. It’s easy to get it to spit out long answers from Stack Overflow verbatim, I’ve done it. Maybe some of the “transformative” nature of the LLM output is the removal of any authorship, copyright, license, and edit history information. ;) The point here is to supplant Google as the portal of information, right? It doesn’t have new information, but it’s pretty good at remixing the words from multiple sources, when it has multiple sources. One possible reason for their legal woes wrt copyright is that it’s also great at memorizing things that only have one source. My college Markov-chain text predictor would do the same thing and easily get stuck in local regions if it couldn’t match something else.

__loam 3y ago
I don't think these can replace search engines.

lodovic 3y ago

I'm sure the NYT uses dictionaries, encyclopaedias and style books verbatim as well. And they don't invent the facts they write about. As journalists they are compiling and passing along other knowledge. You usually don't get a piece of their income when a journalist quotes you verbatim (people usually don't get paid for interviews).

madeofpalk 3y ago
If the NYT reproduces other content verbatim too much, it will get in trouble.
threeseed 3y ago
NYT doesn't reproduce the contents of the dictionary or encyclopaedia. And even if they did it will be fine because those sources allow for it. The point is that OpenAI never asked NYT for permission to use their data.