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The article states: "A large technology company might typically pay new law-school graduates and MBAs salaries and compensation approaching double what they giv

The article states: "A large technology company might typically pay new law-school graduates and MBAs salaries and compensation approaching double what they give new master’s degree grads in computer science. " But, from what I've read, those high-paying law school jobs are very few, only for the elite of the elite, and requires the new employee to work insane hours. Same for those MBAs. I'm pretty sure that, on average, a new master's degree grad in Computer Science outperforms a typical law school graduate, and should be close or better than an MBA. Let's Google: http://www.nalp.org/classof2010_salpressrel http://www.nalp.org/classof2010_salpressrel Law graduates: "The national median salary for the Class of 2010, based on those working full-time and reporting a salary, was $63,000" and only because of those few outliers making $160,000. http://edition.cnn.com/2011/LIVING/06/06/paying.jobs.2011.grads.cb/index.html http://edition.cnn.com/2011/LIVING/06/06/paying.jobs.2011.gr... "Computer science -- Average annual salary offer to 2011 grads: $63,017" http://www.businessweek.com/bschools/content/sep2009/bs20090928_592028.htm http://www.businessweek.com/bschools/content/sep2009/bs20090... "PayScale's average (for starting salary MBAs) clicks in at a much more modest $66,300" So, basically, he's wrong.

gwern 15y ago
He also mentions that programmers are supposed to move up the ladder, and there are fewer upper management jobs. So obviously there's going to be unemployment for those programmers who don't get the rare slots - but that also implies that getting an English degree becomes more of a lottery ticket than a CS degree. Do you win the upper management job and continue increasing your income over your entire career? Or do you work at McDonalds? Perhaps you'd rather be a programmer where you aren't assuming so much risk...
fl3tch 15y ago
> But, from what I've read, those high-paying law school jobs are very few, only for the elite of the elite, and requires the new employee to work insane hours. Same for those MBAs. My sister got a law degree and then did an internship specializing in tax law (I know). She got a job last year straight out of college (at age 25) making $130,000 at a firm that handles the tax issues when one company wants to acquire another. Among all the jobs you could have as a corporate (and especially tax) lawyer, it seemed pretty cool. One of her early projects involved a well-known entertainment company that wanted to buy another entertainment company (although the deal eventually fell through). In recent months she's been crying a lot and wanting to quit. She works 6-7 days a week and 12+ hours a day. She's never home and has no life. She'd rather start her own restaurant, which is something that she's always had a passion for. Even if her pay were cut to 25% of what it is now for the first few years, she says she would be happier, but she's contractually stuck in this job for a minimum of 12 months (until September), so it's kind of a personal hell. Also, there's the sunk cost issue. She's already devoted 8 years of her life and $100,000 to preparing for this career, so it's hard to just walk away. My point is, good money is rarely easy.
- RedwoodCity 15y ago
  Many people are graduating from law school with the same amount of debt as your sister and no job. While programmers in general seem to have a better shot at getting their first job.
- sedachv 15y ago
  > My point is, good money is rarely easy. You should ask her if she seriously talked to the partners managing her about scaling back her hours. I'm not a psychic, but I'm very certain that she hasn't actually done that. A friend of mine has a very similar story ($160k straight out of law school in NYC and hating it) and is dealing with it in a similar way (passive-aggressive complaining to friends and relatives, escapist fantasies, but hers center around travel instead of restaurateurism). A lot of people seem to be closet masochists when it comes to work. If you tackle the issues bothering you directly you'll be surprised how easy they are to resolve, and your managers will respect you more for standing up for yourself.
- gte910h 15y ago
  Few lawyers make good money when you look at hours worked. You'd make far more in software working those hours than you will for many decades (if ever) as a lawyer.
rayiner 15y ago
The author definitely does a little bit of comparing the average case in engineering to the top 10-15% case in law. That said, the tone rang true for me. I left engineering for law because I didn't want to be a 40 year-old engineer with all of the things that entails. In law the older you get the more valuable your experience makes you. You can be 70 and still practicing law. In engineering you're forced to move into management or business to give the young people a chance to fuck things up.

gwern 15y ago

He also mentions that programmers are supposed to move up the ladder, and there are fewer upper management jobs. So obviously there's going to be unemployment for those programmers who don't get the rare slots - but that also implies that getting an English degree becomes more of a lottery ticket than a CS degree. Do you win the upper management job and continue increasing your income over your entire career? Or do you work at McDonalds? Perhaps you'd rather be a programmer where you aren't assuming so much risk...

fl3tch 15y ago

> But, from what I've read, those high-paying law school jobs are very few, only for the elite of the elite, and requires the new employee to work insane hours. Same for those MBAs. My sister got a law degree and then did an internship specializing in tax law (I know). She got a job last year straight out of college (at age 25) making $130,000 at a firm that handles the tax issues when one company wants to acquire another. Among all the jobs you could have as a corporate (and especially tax) lawyer, it seemed pretty cool. One of her early projects involved a well-known entertainment company that wanted to buy another entertainment company (although the deal eventually fell through). In recent months she's been crying a lot and wanting to quit. She works 6-7 days a week and 12+ hours a day. She's never home and has no life. She'd rather start her own restaurant, which is something that she's always had a passion for. Even if her pay were cut to 25% of what it is now for the first few years, she says she would be happier, but she's contractually stuck in this job for a minimum of 12 months (until September), so it's kind of a personal hell. Also, there's the sunk cost issue. She's already devoted 8 years of her life and $100,000 to preparing for this career, so it's hard to just walk away. My point is, good money is rarely easy.

RedwoodCity 15y ago
Many people are graduating from law school with the same amount of debt as your sister and no job. While programmers in general seem to have a better shot at getting their first job.
sedachv 15y ago
> My point is, good money is rarely easy. You should ask her if she seriously talked to the partners managing her about scaling back her hours. I'm not a psychic, but I'm very certain that she hasn't actually done that. A friend of mine has a very similar story ($160k straight out of law school in NYC and hating it) and is dealing with it in a similar way (passive-aggressive complaining to friends and relatives, escapist fantasies, but hers center around travel instead of restaurateurism). A lot of people seem to be closet masochists when it comes to work. If you tackle the issues bothering you directly you'll be surprised how easy they are to resolve, and your managers will respect you more for standing up for yourself.
gte910h 15y ago
Few lawyers make good money when you look at hours worked. You'd make far more in software working those hours than you will for many decades (if ever) as a lawyer.

rayiner 15y ago

The author definitely does a little bit of comparing the average case in engineering to the top 10-15% case in law. That said, the tone rang true for me. I left engineering for law because I didn't want to be a 40 year-old engineer with all of the things that entails. In law the older you get the more valuable your experience makes you. You can be 70 and still practicing law. In engineering you're forced to move into management or business to give the young people a chance to fuck things up.