4 ms·

> Strong leading women aren't the problem either. We've had those ages ago. Hell, Leia’s depicted as more savvy, braver, tougher, and cleverer than the other t

> Strong leading women aren't the problem either. We've had those ages ago. Hell, Leia’s depicted as more savvy, braver, tougher, and cleverer than the other two main characters in 1977 Star Wars, and it’s not even close. Or subtle.

theshrike79 3y ago
There's a difference, she's savvy, brave, tough and clever. As she should. But she doesn't solo the whole Imperial Army while the rest are just sidekicks. She has her strengths, Hand and Luke have theirs.
nicbou 3y ago
You're right, Leia was a much better character than Rey. Could it be that messaging aside, the newer movies are just lazily written? I place them in the same bucket as the last seasons of Game or Thrones. What makes them bad is not the wokeness, but simply the bad writing. I think that we can have both: trope subversions and good writing. I don't think that the problem is too many subversions; it's not enough good writing.
- wharvle 3y ago
  His dialog and such seem fine (or at least he doesn’t screw up what others put there) but JJ Abrams’ plotting, in particular, is chiefly defined by its… well, generously, childlike qualities. You can certainly tell when he’s been involved in a script. “Lazy” would certainly be a term one might apply to it.
- theshrike79 3y ago
  > You're right, Leia was a much better character than Rey. Rey's issue is what's plaguing too many female movie characters today. She had no flaws she had to overcome. She was perfect from the start and didn't have to grow. She had a few training montages in the movie, but that's about it. In Brave for example, Merida's pride (a flaw) causes her mother to be cursed. She has to learn to accept help from others to grow.
shiroiuma 3y ago
She's all those things, but she's still a princess. Even better is Ellen Ripley in 1979's "Alien": she's just a space trucker basically, doing a shitty, dirty job hauling ore from distant star systems, and suddenly has to deal with a human-hunting xenomorph. She returns in 1986's "Aliens" and takes on a giant alien queen single-handedly after rescuing some space marines.

theshrike79 3y ago

There's a difference, she's savvy, brave, tough and clever. As she should. But she doesn't solo the whole Imperial Army while the rest are just sidekicks. She has her strengths, Hand and Luke have theirs.

nicbou 3y ago

You're right, Leia was a much better character than Rey. Could it be that messaging aside, the newer movies are just lazily written? I place them in the same bucket as the last seasons of Game or Thrones. What makes them bad is not the wokeness, but simply the bad writing. I think that we can have both: trope subversions and good writing. I don't think that the problem is too many subversions; it's not enough good writing.

wharvle 3y ago
His dialog and such seem fine (or at least he doesn’t screw up what others put there) but JJ Abrams’ plotting, in particular, is chiefly defined by its… well, generously, childlike qualities. You can certainly tell when he’s been involved in a script. “Lazy” would certainly be a term one might apply to it.
theshrike79 3y ago
> You're right, Leia was a much better character than Rey. Rey's issue is what's plaguing too many female movie characters today. She had no flaws she had to overcome. She was perfect from the start and didn't have to grow. She had a few training montages in the movie, but that's about it. In Brave for example, Merida's pride (a flaw) causes her mother to be cursed. She has to learn to accept help from others to grow.

shiroiuma 3y ago

She's all those things, but she's still a princess. Even better is Ellen Ripley in 1979's "Alien": she's just a space trucker basically, doing a shitty, dirty job hauling ore from distant star systems, and suddenly has to deal with a human-hunting xenomorph. She returns in 1986's "Aliens" and takes on a giant alien queen single-handedly after rescuing some space marines.