4 ms·

Tying means forcing people to buy an undesired good when they buy a desired good. Is anybody buying an iPhone who doesn’t want the App Store?

AnthonyMouse 3y ago
Of course there are. There are people who like the hardware, or the OS, or don't want a green bubble, but would be happy to have F-Droid or Steam on iOS, or get a discount on existing apps by buying them through someone who charges a lower fee. Or just have the competition to Apple's store which could cause Apple to charge a lower fee themselves.
- askonomm 3y ago
  As if Apple was some government provided service that you are entitled to because you pay taxes. It's not. It's a for-profit company of which you are not a board member. If you want F-droid, use Android. If you want App Store, use iPhone. If you want both at the same time, well, buy both phones then. People who want a Ferrari and a minivan don't ask Ferrari to make minivans, they buy both, because both together is ridiculous.
summerlight 3y ago
https://www.justice.gov/archives/atr/competition-and-monopoly-single-firm-conduct-under-section-2-sherman-act-chapter-5 https://www.justice.gov/archives/atr/competition-and-monopol... Your interpretation on tying is not well aligned with usual legal interpretation. Unless the App Store is considered not to be a separate product (which had been Apple's argument for a long time on App Store and Safari by designating them as "system services of iOS"), this is clearly tying. The question is if Apple's current practice is illegal tying or not. Whether the customer wants it or not is not important here; you can give them freely to gain market dominance then reap profits later on whenever the competitors are all gone.
- TheCycoONE 3y ago
  On that note, how is Microsoft getting away with it with respect to the office apps which use to be available independently but now can only be purchased in bundles; adding Teams on top of that?
  - summerlight 3y ago
    https://www.reuters.com/technology/microsoft-unbundle-teams-office-seeks-avert-eu-antitrust-fine-2023-08-31/ https://www.reuters.com/technology/microsoft-unbundle-teams-... MS actually doesn't have a good argument there, so they decided to unbundle it.

AnthonyMouse 3y ago

Of course there are. There are people who like the hardware, or the OS, or don't want a green bubble, but would be happy to have F-Droid or Steam on iOS, or get a discount on existing apps by buying them through someone who charges a lower fee. Or just have the competition to Apple's store which could cause Apple to charge a lower fee themselves.

askonomm 3y ago
As if Apple was some government provided service that you are entitled to because you pay taxes. It's not. It's a for-profit company of which you are not a board member. If you want F-droid, use Android. If you want App Store, use iPhone. If you want both at the same time, well, buy both phones then. People who want a Ferrari and a minivan don't ask Ferrari to make minivans, they buy both, because both together is ridiculous.

summerlight 3y ago

https://www.justice.gov/archives/atr/competition-and-monopoly-single-firm-conduct-under-section-2-sherman-act-chapter-5 https://www.justice.gov/archives/atr/competition-and-monopol... Your interpretation on tying is not well aligned with usual legal interpretation. Unless the App Store is considered not to be a separate product (which had been Apple's argument for a long time on App Store and Safari by designating them as "system services of iOS"), this is clearly tying. The question is if Apple's current practice is illegal tying or not. Whether the customer wants it or not is not important here; you can give them freely to gain market dominance then reap profits later on whenever the competitors are all gone.

TheCycoONE 3y ago
On that note, how is Microsoft getting away with it with respect to the office apps which use to be available independently but now can only be purchased in bundles; adding Teams on top of that?
- summerlight 3y ago
  https://www.reuters.com/technology/microsoft-unbundle-teams-office-seeks-avert-eu-antitrust-fine-2023-08-31/ https://www.reuters.com/technology/microsoft-unbundle-teams-... MS actually doesn't have a good argument there, so they decided to unbundle it.