4 ms·

Very much so and it all happens with zero transparency, explanation or acknowledgement, very sus. Your account can also be effectively shadowbanned with everyt

Very much so and it all happens with zero transparency, explanation or acknowledgement, very sus. Your account can also be effectively shadowbanned with everything you submit going straight to the “dead” pile. Again no explanation and the only way you realize it is cause your submissions slowly die with no comments (and when you view the site in a non logged in fashion your submissions are not there)

tptacek 3y ago
That happens to spammers and serial abusers and, as I understand it, nobody else. People are overwhelmingly told when they're banned.
- realusername 3y ago
  I've seen at least one user recently which has all his comments as [dead] automatically and they are pretty normal comments. I did not write down the name but I've seen that only once.
  - censthrowaway23 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - pvg 3y ago
      We do know to a reasonable degree because otherwise the ‘improperly’ banned would make a noticeable fuss. It’s not a common enough occurrence but maybe you have some in mind.
      - romafirst3 3y ago
        Huh? How would they know to make a fuss. They aren’t even notified, they are shadow banned.
        pvg 3y ago
        How would they know to make a fuss. This is not hard to figure out plus when it was frequent, they did.
  - Jtsummers 3y ago
    Assuming no violent (as in promoting) or particularly racist/sexist comments in their history, this hits some new accounts if they're using a VPN (some particular VPNs, I guess?). Sometimes they get caught up in the same filters used to block spammers/abusers from using HN. Or if their first (or one of their first) comments was a link without substantial text, that also gets people put into some kind of "spammer" category. You, or they if you tell them, can reach out through the email in the contact link at the bottom to get the ban addressed.
    - realusername 3y ago
      I found back the username in my browser history, the name is baybal2, it's a fairly old account so I'm not sure what caused it. I'm going to contact the moderation indeed, it's the first time I was seeing non-spam comments being shadow banned automatically.
      - deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
      - justsomehnguy 3y ago
        > so I'm not sure what caused it The behaviour of the account holder.
      - nkurz 3y ago
        You've found an odd edge-case. baybal2 is banned intentionally, despite the fact that most of his posts are good, and some are great. Unfortunately, the remainder aren't. The compromise is that he's banned, but users like me vouch for many of his good posts to make them visible. Here's a post from Dan about him a couple years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29692791 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29692791. And another from 4 years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21195898 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21195898.
  - dang 3y ago
    This could be because they got caught in a spam filter, or because we banned them and the comments they've posted since then are better. In such cases we're always happy to take a look and unban the account if they're using HN as intended. There are some weird edge cases, like sometimes a banned user, once they're unbanned, will revert to posting abusively. Then we ban them again and they revert to posting good comments again. Who can fathom the psyche of homo internetus. It's also common for an account to post both fine comments and abusive comments. It's the latter that determine whether we have to ban the account—that's how rule enforcement works. But if a banned account posts something good, there's no reason why the good post needs to remain [dead]. This is what vouching is for: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html#cvouch https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html#cvouch.
    - realusername 3y ago
      Thanks, I didn't know about vouching. I guess there's indeed an history behind each ban of a real user. (Not talking about spam of course, it's a different thing)
      - lazyasciiart 3y ago
        Sometimes the history is “your account was pretty new so when you posted something a lot of people didn’t like we assumed you were a troll, banned, and never looked again”.
- beebeepka 3y ago
  [flagged]

tptacek 3y ago

That happens to spammers and serial abusers and, as I understand it, nobody else. People are overwhelmingly told when they're banned.

realusername 3y ago
I've seen at least one user recently which has all his comments as [dead] automatically and they are pretty normal comments. I did not write down the name but I've seen that only once.
- censthrowaway23 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - pvg 3y ago
    We do know to a reasonable degree because otherwise the ‘improperly’ banned would make a noticeable fuss. It’s not a common enough occurrence but maybe you have some in mind.
    - romafirst3 3y ago
      Huh? How would they know to make a fuss. They aren’t even notified, they are shadow banned.
      - pvg 3y ago
        How would they know to make a fuss. This is not hard to figure out plus when it was frequent, they did.
- Jtsummers 3y ago
  Assuming no violent (as in promoting) or particularly racist/sexist comments in their history, this hits some new accounts if they're using a VPN (some particular VPNs, I guess?). Sometimes they get caught up in the same filters used to block spammers/abusers from using HN. Or if their first (or one of their first) comments was a link without substantial text, that also gets people put into some kind of "spammer" category. You, or they if you tell them, can reach out through the email in the contact link at the bottom to get the ban addressed.
  - realusername 3y ago
    I found back the username in my browser history, the name is baybal2, it's a fairly old account so I'm not sure what caused it. I'm going to contact the moderation indeed, it's the first time I was seeing non-spam comments being shadow banned automatically.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - justsomehnguy 3y ago
      > so I'm not sure what caused it The behaviour of the account holder.
    - nkurz 3y ago
      You've found an odd edge-case. baybal2 is banned intentionally, despite the fact that most of his posts are good, and some are great. Unfortunately, the remainder aren't. The compromise is that he's banned, but users like me vouch for many of his good posts to make them visible. Here's a post from Dan about him a couple years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29692791 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29692791. And another from 4 years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21195898 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21195898.
- dang 3y ago
  This could be because they got caught in a spam filter, or because we banned them and the comments they've posted since then are better. In such cases we're always happy to take a look and unban the account if they're using HN as intended. There are some weird edge cases, like sometimes a banned user, once they're unbanned, will revert to posting abusively. Then we ban them again and they revert to posting good comments again. Who can fathom the psyche of homo internetus. It's also common for an account to post both fine comments and abusive comments. It's the latter that determine whether we have to ban the account—that's how rule enforcement works. But if a banned account posts something good, there's no reason why the good post needs to remain [dead]. This is what vouching is for: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html#cvouch https://news.ycombinator.com/newsfaq.html#cvouch.
  - realusername 3y ago
    Thanks, I didn't know about vouching. I guess there's indeed an history behind each ban of a real user. (Not talking about spam of course, it's a different thing)
    - lazyasciiart 3y ago
      Sometimes the history is “your account was pretty new so when you posted something a lot of people didn’t like we assumed you were a troll, banned, and never looked again”.
beebeepka 3y ago
[flagged]