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Are you sure that's true? https://qz.com/1701404/walmart-allegedly-created-fictitious-chinese-jv-to-avoid-us-tax https://qz.com/1701404/walmart-allegedly-creat

Are you sure that's true? https://qz.com/1701404/walmart-allegedly-created-fictitious-chinese-jv-to-avoid-us-tax https://qz.com/1701404/walmart-allegedly-created-fictitious-... https://www.commercialappeal.com/story/opinion/2017/04/08/walmart-tax-every-american-taxpayer-pays/100188002/ https://www.commercialappeal.com/story/opinion/2017/04/08/wa... https://americansfortaxfairness.org/files/ATF-Key-Findings-One-Pager-orange-header.pdf https://americansfortaxfairness.org/files/ATF-Key-Findings-O...

pandaman 3y ago
Police is funded with the local taxes: business, property and sales. Your articles show no evidence of Walmart not paying those, just the US taxes, which do not fund the police (at least directly, there are some federal grants to local police forces but those are: a) small fraction of the budget b) are given to pushing the federal partisan polices and not the actual enforcing of the laws).
- jliptzin 3y ago
  https://goodjobsfirst.org/report-walmart-state-and-local-tax-avoidance-exceeds-400-million-annually/ https://goodjobsfirst.org/report-walmart-state-and-local-tax... They also don’t seem to make an effort to actually stop shoplifting. They take out regular check out lanes and replace them with self check outs that are unbelievably frustrating to use and make it very easy to shoplift accidentally. One time I apparently shoplifted an item by accident while using the self checkout lane, the only reason I realized is because I went back to return the item and it wasn’t on the receipt. The clerk helping me with the return just laughed and said it happens all the time. If their only response to shoplifting is to just jack up prices and then go on TV and blame democrats for “crime” while doing literally nothing to stop shoplifting then I have little to no sympathy for them.
  - pandaman 3y ago
    That article does not say that Walmart does not pay local taxes but suggests that it should not have used legal allowances it was given and pay more than it should by law. Your shopping experience in Walmart does not seem to be relevant at all, if you don't like it - don't go there, it in no way justifies allowing crime against Walmart to go unpunished.
    - eesmith 3y ago
      Are you really so focused on just this one sort of crime, or does your opinion extend equally to all other crimes? We accept that some crimes go unpunished, yes? We don't hire enough traffic police to detect and punish all speeders, even though that's a crime, and that's only one of many crimes I can think of which are underprosecuted. Nor is there much of a cry to increase the number of traffic police and bring traffic speed down to the posted limits. So why must all shoplifting by punished, with the police doing most of the work at the store? We've long said that if an organization needs a higher level of security they can have their own security force, which may be private guards or a private police force, as with some campus police, transit police, and railroad police forces. Just like there is no law saying a store must pay more than is legally required, there is also no law saying the government is required to supply a police force for the store. Nor does it make economic sense for broadly trained police to handle a specialized task like providing security for a store. One of the biggest crimes is wage theft. The total cost of wage theft is estimated at 100x that of every robbery: https://www.workingnowandthen.com/blog/wage-theft-the-50-billion-crime-against-workers/ https://www.workingnowandthen.com/blog/wage-theft-the-50-bil... We know Walmart has committed that crime. ("According to a 2018 report by Good Jobs, between January 2000 to 2018, Walmart paid over $1.4bn in fines and settlements over wage theft violations, FedEx paid over $500m during the same period, and Bank of America paid over $380m." - https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/15/wage-theft-us-workers-employees https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/15/wage-theft-u... ). Will these police officers assigned to Walmart also be charged with investigating and preventing wage theft at those stores? No, of course that hasn't been part of the general discussion. What, in your opinion, justifies allowing wage theft by Walmart to go unpunished?
      - pandaman 3y ago
        >Are you really so focused on just this one sort of crime, or does your opinion extend equally to all other crimes? In the US, there are thousands of crimes on the books, which are not enforced and are ridiculous [1]. So no, I do not think that all crimes should be punished. >So why must all shoplifting by punished, with the police doing most of the work at the store? This is a loaded question. I don't think the police should be doing most of the work at the store, but I think the police should take the apprehended criminals from the store when called. And DAs should prosecute those, and the judges should try them, that's all. Nothing of this happens right now. This is why stores do not try to apprehend criminals as the same police, DA and judges will happily go after the business and its employees if the criminal is hurt in the process or claims to be hurt[2]. 1. https://www.distractify.com/p/ridiculous-laws https://www.distractify.com/p/ridiculous-laws 2. https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/11/us/new-york-bodega-stabbing-murder-charges/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/11/us/new-york-bodega-stabbing-m...
- eesmith 3y ago
  Larger stores, compared to smaller stores, have access to more methods to reduce their tax burden. For example, they have the capital to build a dedicated store for their needs, then place deed restrictions on resale use to prohibit competition, and to have those former sites - which essentially always pay lower tax rates - included as comparables for tax assessment purposes. Eg, https://ilsr.org/dark-store-tax-tactic-makes-big-box-stores-terrible-deal-for-cities/ https://ilsr.org/dark-store-tax-tactic-makes-big-box-stores-... . For another example, a store with the name "PandaMan" may not actually own the trademark to "PandaMan" but instead pay "PM Trademark Holdings", a Delaware LLC, for trademark use. This is a business expense, which reduces the local taxes, and the choice of state LLC can be chosen to reduce overall taxes. Delaware does not charge income tax on royalties. https://troyandschwartzlaw.com/2020/09/holding-companies-strategy-ip-asset-protection-understanding-pros-cons/ https://troyandschwartzlaw.com/2020/09/holding-companies-str... These are called "loopholes" and are of course completely legal. As a result, big box stores pay far than smaller stores in mixed-use areas , when measured in net tax revenue acre. ("Net" is important since it costs the government money to provide the roads, water, sewer, etc.) For example, from https://www.cnu.org/publicsquare/2021/02/11/how-mixed-use-development-can-raise-tax-base https://www.cnu.org/publicsquare/2021/02/11/how-mixed-use-de... regarding Carmel, Indiana: > When left to the market to allow developers to build what they build,” the result is strip centers, he says. “Even nice retail, like the Target on the west side, generates a half million in assessed value per acre.” Stand-alone office buildings generate $1 million to 1.5 million in assessed value per acre, he explains. > “Then you look at redevelopment projects that the mayor and council have done together,” he says. “Instead of a million or a half million per acre, we are netting $23 million in assessed value per acre, $20 million in assessed value per acre. Twenty times the assessed value from redevelopment projects. That locks us into a positive tax generating position for the next hundred years. This is smart planning.” This has been true for a long time, like this 2008 summary of a report from 2003, at https://cdn.ilsr.org/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/bbtk-factsheet-publiccosts.pdf https://cdn.ilsr.org/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/bbtk-factshe... , which shows a net-negative revenue for big box stores, due to the lower tax revenue per acre and higher infrastructure costs than specialty retailers, which had a net positive tax revenue. So maybe the government should say the existing costs to subsidize Walmart are high enough, that government-provided police protection is too much, and if Walmart's business model can't afford additional internal security then it's time for Walmart to leave the area, and let the government support other businesses which both need less subsidizes and provide higher tax revenue.

pandaman 3y ago

Police is funded with the local taxes: business, property and sales. Your articles show no evidence of Walmart not paying those, just the US taxes, which do not fund the police (at least directly, there are some federal grants to local police forces but those are: a) small fraction of the budget b) are given to pushing the federal partisan polices and not the actual enforcing of the laws).

jliptzin 3y ago
https://goodjobsfirst.org/report-walmart-state-and-local-tax-avoidance-exceeds-400-million-annually/ https://goodjobsfirst.org/report-walmart-state-and-local-tax... They also don’t seem to make an effort to actually stop shoplifting. They take out regular check out lanes and replace them with self check outs that are unbelievably frustrating to use and make it very easy to shoplift accidentally. One time I apparently shoplifted an item by accident while using the self checkout lane, the only reason I realized is because I went back to return the item and it wasn’t on the receipt. The clerk helping me with the return just laughed and said it happens all the time. If their only response to shoplifting is to just jack up prices and then go on TV and blame democrats for “crime” while doing literally nothing to stop shoplifting then I have little to no sympathy for them.
- pandaman 3y ago
  That article does not say that Walmart does not pay local taxes but suggests that it should not have used legal allowances it was given and pay more than it should by law. Your shopping experience in Walmart does not seem to be relevant at all, if you don't like it - don't go there, it in no way justifies allowing crime against Walmart to go unpunished.
  - eesmith 3y ago
    Are you really so focused on just this one sort of crime, or does your opinion extend equally to all other crimes? We accept that some crimes go unpunished, yes? We don't hire enough traffic police to detect and punish all speeders, even though that's a crime, and that's only one of many crimes I can think of which are underprosecuted. Nor is there much of a cry to increase the number of traffic police and bring traffic speed down to the posted limits. So why must all shoplifting by punished, with the police doing most of the work at the store? We've long said that if an organization needs a higher level of security they can have their own security force, which may be private guards or a private police force, as with some campus police, transit police, and railroad police forces. Just like there is no law saying a store must pay more than is legally required, there is also no law saying the government is required to supply a police force for the store. Nor does it make economic sense for broadly trained police to handle a specialized task like providing security for a store. One of the biggest crimes is wage theft. The total cost of wage theft is estimated at 100x that of every robbery: https://www.workingnowandthen.com/blog/wage-theft-the-50-billion-crime-against-workers/ https://www.workingnowandthen.com/blog/wage-theft-the-50-bil... We know Walmart has committed that crime. ("According to a 2018 report by Good Jobs, between January 2000 to 2018, Walmart paid over $1.4bn in fines and settlements over wage theft violations, FedEx paid over $500m during the same period, and Bank of America paid over $380m." - https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/15/wage-theft-us-workers-employees https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/jun/15/wage-theft-u... ). Will these police officers assigned to Walmart also be charged with investigating and preventing wage theft at those stores? No, of course that hasn't been part of the general discussion. What, in your opinion, justifies allowing wage theft by Walmart to go unpunished?
    - pandaman 3y ago
      >Are you really so focused on just this one sort of crime, or does your opinion extend equally to all other crimes? In the US, there are thousands of crimes on the books, which are not enforced and are ridiculous [1]. So no, I do not think that all crimes should be punished. >So why must all shoplifting by punished, with the police doing most of the work at the store? This is a loaded question. I don't think the police should be doing most of the work at the store, but I think the police should take the apprehended criminals from the store when called. And DAs should prosecute those, and the judges should try them, that's all. Nothing of this happens right now. This is why stores do not try to apprehend criminals as the same police, DA and judges will happily go after the business and its employees if the criminal is hurt in the process or claims to be hurt[2]. 1. https://www.distractify.com/p/ridiculous-laws https://www.distractify.com/p/ridiculous-laws 2. https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/11/us/new-york-bodega-stabbing-murder-charges/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/11/us/new-york-bodega-stabbing-m...
eesmith 3y ago
Larger stores, compared to smaller stores, have access to more methods to reduce their tax burden. For example, they have the capital to build a dedicated store for their needs, then place deed restrictions on resale use to prohibit competition, and to have those former sites - which essentially always pay lower tax rates - included as comparables for tax assessment purposes. Eg, https://ilsr.org/dark-store-tax-tactic-makes-big-box-stores-terrible-deal-for-cities/ https://ilsr.org/dark-store-tax-tactic-makes-big-box-stores-... . For another example, a store with the name "PandaMan" may not actually own the trademark to "PandaMan" but instead pay "PM Trademark Holdings", a Delaware LLC, for trademark use. This is a business expense, which reduces the local taxes, and the choice of state LLC can be chosen to reduce overall taxes. Delaware does not charge income tax on royalties. https://troyandschwartzlaw.com/2020/09/holding-companies-strategy-ip-asset-protection-understanding-pros-cons/ https://troyandschwartzlaw.com/2020/09/holding-companies-str... These are called "loopholes" and are of course completely legal. As a result, big box stores pay far than smaller stores in mixed-use areas , when measured in net tax revenue acre. ("Net" is important since it costs the government money to provide the roads, water, sewer, etc.) For example, from https://www.cnu.org/publicsquare/2021/02/11/how-mixed-use-development-can-raise-tax-base https://www.cnu.org/publicsquare/2021/02/11/how-mixed-use-de... regarding Carmel, Indiana: > When left to the market to allow developers to build what they build,” the result is strip centers, he says. “Even nice retail, like the Target on the west side, generates a half million in assessed value per acre.” Stand-alone office buildings generate $1 million to 1.5 million in assessed value per acre, he explains. > “Then you look at redevelopment projects that the mayor and council have done together,” he says. “Instead of a million or a half million per acre, we are netting $23 million in assessed value per acre, $20 million in assessed value per acre. Twenty times the assessed value from redevelopment projects. That locks us into a positive tax generating position for the next hundred years. This is smart planning.” This has been true for a long time, like this 2008 summary of a report from 2003, at https://cdn.ilsr.org/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/bbtk-factsheet-publiccosts.pdf https://cdn.ilsr.org/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/bbtk-factshe... , which shows a net-negative revenue for big box stores, due to the lower tax revenue per acre and higher infrastructure costs than specialty retailers, which had a net positive tax revenue. So maybe the government should say the existing costs to subsidize Walmart are high enough, that government-provided police protection is too much, and if Walmart's business model can't afford additional internal security then it's time for Walmart to leave the area, and let the government support other businesses which both need less subsidizes and provide higher tax revenue.