5 ms·

IME, a lot of the best programmers are anal (often to a fault), and won't lie in that situation. Not because of ethics or morals but just because they refuse t

IME, a lot of the best programmers are anal (often to a fault), and won't lie in that situation. Not because of ethics or morals but just because they refuse to say something they know is technically incorrect.

mattmanser 15y ago
Life just doesn't work that way. IME the people who fib a bit and embellish when applying for jobs because they know they can, they do a lot better than those who tell the truth all the time. Reality is most employers put up fake 'requirements' because they don't know how else to find 'smart, can learn, gets stuff done'.
- MaxGabriel 15y ago
  Are you advocating lying in job interviews?
  - RollAHardSix 15y ago
    I think he's advocating 'advancing your skill-set'. Oh And: Self-Marketing, it isn't always evil. But I'm being honest, sometimes you have to make yourself sound good to get the goods.
    - cookiecaper 15y ago
      I think this is a valid to an extent, like accepting a title of "expert" in a technology used by the company that you know well but are not actually a real "expert" in. You and I know that the real experts are the guys constantly replying to stuff on the mailing lists and making lots of significant patches to the core of the project, but sometimes it's OK to condescend to use the vocabulary of the plebes and just embrace "expert" within that context. You aren't deceiving anyone here because it's just a different definition of a word, and you are using the definition that the other people expect. In fact one could say it's deceptive to insist on your specific concept of an expert when you know that the people interviewing just need someone qualified. But I think claiming experience with an explicit version that was stated is going a little bit too far. It's important to clarify. Maybe someone actually does need help with the new platform, and after all, if they're having inept recruiters do their pre-hire screening, you're probably not missing much anyway. There is a bit of line to fudge there but it definitely doesn't extend into falsifying tasks or skillsets imo.
      - RollAHardSix 15y ago
        Definitely. And I suppose I should have clarified; the 'advancing your skill-set' bit was a joke. Or at-least meant to have humour behind it. Sadly the internets doesn't pass off the jovial nature of my voice. :D
davemel37 15y ago
Like Sheldon Cooper in Big Bang Theory when the judge asked him to apologize, "I'm a scientist, I never apologize about the truth!"
marshray 15y ago
I have been hired largely on keyword matches before, it was a bad move. Think about it: most everyone you're going to be working with will have been selected on such a basis as well. Not so much bad people, but on the whole a thoroughly uninspiring workplace where creativity was actively discouraged. Unless I was really desperate, I would prefer not to get hired at a place that used that sort of process.

mattmanser 15y ago

Life just doesn't work that way. IME the people who fib a bit and embellish when applying for jobs because they know they can, they do a lot better than those who tell the truth all the time. Reality is most employers put up fake 'requirements' because they don't know how else to find 'smart, can learn, gets stuff done'.

MaxGabriel 15y ago
Are you advocating lying in job interviews?
- RollAHardSix 15y ago
  I think he's advocating 'advancing your skill-set'. Oh And: Self-Marketing, it isn't always evil. But I'm being honest, sometimes you have to make yourself sound good to get the goods.
  - cookiecaper 15y ago
    I think this is a valid to an extent, like accepting a title of "expert" in a technology used by the company that you know well but are not actually a real "expert" in. You and I know that the real experts are the guys constantly replying to stuff on the mailing lists and making lots of significant patches to the core of the project, but sometimes it's OK to condescend to use the vocabulary of the plebes and just embrace "expert" within that context. You aren't deceiving anyone here because it's just a different definition of a word, and you are using the definition that the other people expect. In fact one could say it's deceptive to insist on your specific concept of an expert when you know that the people interviewing just need someone qualified. But I think claiming experience with an explicit version that was stated is going a little bit too far. It's important to clarify. Maybe someone actually does need help with the new platform, and after all, if they're having inept recruiters do their pre-hire screening, you're probably not missing much anyway. There is a bit of line to fudge there but it definitely doesn't extend into falsifying tasks or skillsets imo.
    - RollAHardSix 15y ago
      Definitely. And I suppose I should have clarified; the 'advancing your skill-set' bit was a joke. Or at-least meant to have humour behind it. Sadly the internets doesn't pass off the jovial nature of my voice. :D

davemel37 15y ago

Like Sheldon Cooper in Big Bang Theory when the judge asked him to apologize, "I'm a scientist, I never apologize about the truth!"

marshray 15y ago

I have been hired largely on keyword matches before, it was a bad move. Think about it: most everyone you're going to be working with will have been selected on such a basis as well. Not so much bad people, but on the whole a thoroughly uninspiring workplace where creativity was actively discouraged. Unless I was really desperate, I would prefer not to get hired at a place that used that sort of process.