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There was a time when a Tesla was something I aspired to own one day, but now I don't think I'd get one even if I had a free pick of any car in that price range

There was a time when a Tesla was something I aspired to own one day, but now I don't think I'd get one even if I had a free pick of any car in that price range. From what I understand they still lead the EV space in several metrics, but other manufacturers have done a lot of catching up in the last few years. Add that to greater reliability and build quality, and inclusion of physical controls (anyone who thinks replacing the indicator/turn signal stalk with capacitive buttons is sensible has clearly never driven in the UK—my 15 minute drive into the office crosses 11 roundabouts). Plus I've developed such a strong personal distaste for Musk over the last few years that it's hard to want to give him money, however indirectly.

pclmulqdq 3y ago
As it turns out, producing a quality product takes a long time. Tesla got to market early by not producing a quality product, but I assumed they would raise the quality bar after they got mass adoption.
- tmpz22 3y ago
  > Tesla got to market early by not producing a quality product I'd argue Tesla min/maxed aspects of their product that gave them a initial strong lead in product space. Quintessentially performance/distance/charger-availability, but also some aspects of their tech really stood out like the touchscreen performance and mobile integration (relative to what other cars had in the mid 2010s. IMO that initial lead has diminished. Other brands are catching up and do better in terms of some aspects of quality control and now reputation. If this trend continues I think we could see Tesla losing in most metrics, although we still probably have a good chunk of time until that happens. If I had to buy an electric car today Tesla would still be one of the first cars I researched. Maybe Tesla would win. But in a few years I wholly expect another brand would win out.
- FireBeyond 3y ago
  ... and by espousing that they knew better than legacy auto how to build the lines, and ignoring a century of learned study.
- stonemetal12 3y ago
  >not producing a quality product That is a little harsh, according to that recent Consumer Reports study Tesla is middle of the pack on reliability. At least according to Ars' take on the data, they build a quite good powertrain it is the rest of the car they haven't gotten good at yet. https://arstechnica.com/cars/2023/11/evs-have-79-more-reliability-problems-than-gas-cars-says-consumer-reports/ https://arstechnica.com/cars/2023/11/evs-have-79-more-reliab...
dylan604 3y ago
I feel the same way. Tesla has now been around long enough that the reality distortion field is no longer able to be maintained. Too many cars have been sold, and too many disgruntled owners/employees have enough negative experiences to now voice their concerns in numbers no longer able to be dismissed as "the haters".
solardev 3y ago
You perfectly captured my thoughts too. When I was younger, I was so excited about these spaceship cars. Then I rode in one and hated the UX, every single thing from the stupid door handles to the lack of knobs to being unable to open the glove compartment. Just, why?! And then they kept lying about the self driving problems and kept trying to gaslight their customers about all the issues. All that was before the Fall of Musk. I just can't trust Tesla at all. There was some awesome engineering done there (much respect, honestly), but at the end of the day I think I prefer a boring car that wasn't built with a "move fast and break things and kill people" mentality.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
filoleg 3y ago
> anyone who thinks replacing the indicator/turn signal stalk with capacitive buttons is sensible has clearly never driven in the UK—my 15 minute drive into the office crosses 11 roundabouts Is there a car that currently actually does it? Asking because I am yet to see one. And every single tesla model I’ve ever seen in real life uses normal turn signal stalks, so that wasn’t the car you were referencing either.
- some0x80070005 3y ago
  The poster was referring to the Model 3 Highland refresh and allegedly the upcoming Model Y Juniper refresh. That is where the turn stalk was replaced with capacitive touch buttons on three steering wheel.
  - AlexandrB 3y ago
    God help Canadian Tesla drivers in the winter - most gloves don't work well with capacitive buttons/screens. Edit: Actually, with how dry it can get in wintertime, sometimes my fingers don't even work.
- deergomoo 3y ago
  The latest Model 3 refresh ditches the stalk, though it’s not due to land in the UK until 2024 I believe. Several UK-based outlets have coverage of it though, which is how I learned of it.
cmsonger 3y ago
My sentiment exactly mirrors yours. I own a 2017 S100D. It has turn signal stalks, and wiper stalks, and has been (and is) a good car. My only complaint is that I hate the HVAC being on touch screen. New Tesla's are literally worse to my thinking. Would I like more range? Sure, I guess, but truth is that 70% charge on the S is reliably enough range that unless I'm traveling cross country, the car just tops up every night. I will buy another EV. It's very unlikely to be a Tesla both for their ergonomic design and Elon's very public display of policy positions and opinions that I disagree with.

pclmulqdq 3y ago

As it turns out, producing a quality product takes a long time. Tesla got to market early by not producing a quality product, but I assumed they would raise the quality bar after they got mass adoption.

tmpz22 3y ago
> Tesla got to market early by not producing a quality product I'd argue Tesla min/maxed aspects of their product that gave them a initial strong lead in product space. Quintessentially performance/distance/charger-availability, but also some aspects of their tech really stood out like the touchscreen performance and mobile integration (relative to what other cars had in the mid 2010s. IMO that initial lead has diminished. Other brands are catching up and do better in terms of some aspects of quality control and now reputation. If this trend continues I think we could see Tesla losing in most metrics, although we still probably have a good chunk of time until that happens. If I had to buy an electric car today Tesla would still be one of the first cars I researched. Maybe Tesla would win. But in a few years I wholly expect another brand would win out.
FireBeyond 3y ago
... and by espousing that they knew better than legacy auto how to build the lines, and ignoring a century of learned study.
stonemetal12 3y ago
>not producing a quality product That is a little harsh, according to that recent Consumer Reports study Tesla is middle of the pack on reliability. At least according to Ars' take on the data, they build a quite good powertrain it is the rest of the car they haven't gotten good at yet. https://arstechnica.com/cars/2023/11/evs-have-79-more-reliability-problems-than-gas-cars-says-consumer-reports/ https://arstechnica.com/cars/2023/11/evs-have-79-more-reliab...

dylan604 3y ago

I feel the same way. Tesla has now been around long enough that the reality distortion field is no longer able to be maintained. Too many cars have been sold, and too many disgruntled owners/employees have enough negative experiences to now voice their concerns in numbers no longer able to be dismissed as "the haters".

solardev 3y ago

You perfectly captured my thoughts too. When I was younger, I was so excited about these spaceship cars. Then I rode in one and hated the UX, every single thing from the stupid door handles to the lack of knobs to being unable to open the glove compartment. Just, why?! And then they kept lying about the self driving problems and kept trying to gaslight their customers about all the issues. All that was before the Fall of Musk. I just can't trust Tesla at all. There was some awesome engineering done there (much respect, honestly), but at the end of the day I think I prefer a boring car that wasn't built with a "move fast and break things and kill people" mentality.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

filoleg 3y ago

> anyone who thinks replacing the indicator/turn signal stalk with capacitive buttons is sensible has clearly never driven in the UK—my 15 minute drive into the office crosses 11 roundabouts Is there a car that currently actually does it? Asking because I am yet to see one. And every single tesla model I’ve ever seen in real life uses normal turn signal stalks, so that wasn’t the car you were referencing either.

some0x80070005 3y ago
The poster was referring to the Model 3 Highland refresh and allegedly the upcoming Model Y Juniper refresh. That is where the turn stalk was replaced with capacitive touch buttons on three steering wheel.
- AlexandrB 3y ago
  God help Canadian Tesla drivers in the winter - most gloves don't work well with capacitive buttons/screens. Edit: Actually, with how dry it can get in wintertime, sometimes my fingers don't even work.
deergomoo 3y ago
The latest Model 3 refresh ditches the stalk, though it’s not due to land in the UK until 2024 I believe. Several UK-based outlets have coverage of it though, which is how I learned of it.

cmsonger 3y ago

My sentiment exactly mirrors yours. I own a 2017 S100D. It has turn signal stalks, and wiper stalks, and has been (and is) a good car. My only complaint is that I hate the HVAC being on touch screen. New Tesla's are literally worse to my thinking. Would I like more range? Sure, I guess, but truth is that 70% charge on the S is reliably enough range that unless I'm traveling cross country, the car just tops up every night. I will buy another EV. It's very unlikely to be a Tesla both for their ergonomic design and Elon's very public display of policy positions and opinions that I disagree with.