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I actually like the high bar thats set by no-coiners, it really does improve the space This practically guarantees the bitcoin market will become extremely liq

I actually like the high bar thats set by no-coiners, it really does improve the space This practically guarantees the bitcoin market will become extremely liquid for extremely large amounts over on wallstreetjournal comments it is still common to see out of touch people wonder if anyone’s ever converted their crypto to cash, not knowing how commonplace that is globally for the last 10 years as they’ve only seen negative headlines their entire life its still common for people to have antiquated views about the level of liquidity in the crypto space. “Good luck cashing out those millions!” cashes out hundreds of millions this standard would move that to billions very easily in a single transaction near the best bid and ask, with dozens of bitcoin ETFs always doing transactions to match retail order flows in the stock market.

MuffinFlavored 3y ago
> This practically guarantees the bitcoin market will become extremely liquid for extremely large amounts Isn't it actively walking towards block-halving and there being a fixed number of coins in circulation (aka walking towards eventual illiquidity)?
- yieldcrv 3y ago
  by large amounts I was referring to large amounts of notional US dollars worth of bitcoin if bitcoin becomes more scarce with that large notional demand, it will be fewer bitcoin traded at higher prices regarding the block-halving issuance schedule, one of the advances bitcoin heralded 15 years ago was being an infinitely divisible asset. so if people want to hoard their bitcoin then smaller and smaller units can trade in that reality, to accommodate larger and larger notional values of fiat to trade. but this alone goes hand in hand with the purpose of the block halving - thats just a subsidy to spur a parallel economy, as the block reward is intended to be supplanted by the transaction fees to redistribute bitcoin. this is already working successfully, most bitcoin blocks this year have transaction fees greater than the block reward. the same has occurred on the Ethereum network for extended periods of time too. the SEC’s arbitrary and encumbering standard increases the number of transactions on the bitcoin network too. strengthening the velocity of transactions and therefore its transaction fee economy. this has come to fruition in every macroeconomic environment now. one can transparently see how bitcoin is hoarded, to me its more interesting that it matches the same distribution of most other asset classes. The M1 in currency is the tiny percentage actively traded and used as cash with merchants, a small percent of the float trades for equities, commodities. no-coiners try to use the same standards to denigrate bitcoin, but functionally bitcoin and crypto do meet their prior bars and surpass them solely due to the pressure.
  - rspeele 3y ago
    > most bitcoin blocks this year have transaction fees greater than the block reward What? [1]https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-fee_to_reward.html#1y https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-fee_to_reward.h...
    - yieldcrv 3y ago
      thanks for the data, I stand corrected! I had read an exuberant twitter thread about ordinal inscriptions tl;dr the trend is up with spike periods of transaction fees making up 25 - 45% of the block reward. so with the exact same amount of activity after the next halving it will be 50 - 90%. that's a good indicator of network health and fulfilling its vision of the network sustaining itself after block rewards subside.
TacticalCoder 3y ago
> “Good luck cashing out those millions!” cashes out hundreds of millions I'm helping a non-tecchie with the technical details (she bought Bitcoin years ago, stored them on a Ledger with the help of someone, has no idea how to safely get them out / how to update her Ledger / etc.) and there's some truth to what you say but... In the EU at least it can be very difficult to cash out any sizeable amount. 10 K? Sure, fine. 10 millions and more? You go to a private bank and they'll be very interested in helping you out. But you have anywhere from a few hundred Ks to 2 or 3 millions: that's too small of a fry for a private bank and way too scary for people doing KYC/AML at regular consumer banks. I'm literally talking about banks kicking people out as soon as they mention they have 1 million+ in crypto. Put it this way: it's easier to cash out hundreds of millions than it is to cash out one million. It's all people working in banks/finance/funds around me and that subject comes out often. There are people who manage to cash out but there also people having lots of issues. Cashing out a sizeable amount is doable but it can definitely be very complicated. At least in the EU. P.S: btw I'm talking about ordinary people who did absolutely nothing wrong: they just made an ultra speculative (but legal) investment in Bitcoin and/or shitcoins which, on paper, paid off.
- yieldcrv 3y ago
  I know OTC desks that can handle that for competitive spreads but Coinbase also services the Eurozone and UK. they also have an OTC desk. all been easy for over half a decade. you dont mention that word to banks.
- jbverschoor 3y ago
  Well, here in the Netherlands, banks someone flag grocery transactions as suspicious with the result that average joe will have to provide evidence and all kind of crap to prevent his bank account from being closed. “CDD” If that happens, you’re cut off. No more insurance, banking, mortgage, nothing.

MuffinFlavored 3y ago

> This practically guarantees the bitcoin market will become extremely liquid for extremely large amounts Isn't it actively walking towards block-halving and there being a fixed number of coins in circulation (aka walking towards eventual illiquidity)?

yieldcrv 3y ago
by large amounts I was referring to large amounts of notional US dollars worth of bitcoin if bitcoin becomes more scarce with that large notional demand, it will be fewer bitcoin traded at higher prices regarding the block-halving issuance schedule, one of the advances bitcoin heralded 15 years ago was being an infinitely divisible asset. so if people want to hoard their bitcoin then smaller and smaller units can trade in that reality, to accommodate larger and larger notional values of fiat to trade. but this alone goes hand in hand with the purpose of the block halving - thats just a subsidy to spur a parallel economy, as the block reward is intended to be supplanted by the transaction fees to redistribute bitcoin. this is already working successfully, most bitcoin blocks this year have transaction fees greater than the block reward. the same has occurred on the Ethereum network for extended periods of time too. the SEC’s arbitrary and encumbering standard increases the number of transactions on the bitcoin network too. strengthening the velocity of transactions and therefore its transaction fee economy. this has come to fruition in every macroeconomic environment now. one can transparently see how bitcoin is hoarded, to me its more interesting that it matches the same distribution of most other asset classes. The M1 in currency is the tiny percentage actively traded and used as cash with merchants, a small percent of the float trades for equities, commodities. no-coiners try to use the same standards to denigrate bitcoin, but functionally bitcoin and crypto do meet their prior bars and surpass them solely due to the pressure.
- rspeele 3y ago
  > most bitcoin blocks this year have transaction fees greater than the block reward What? [1]https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-fee_to_reward.html#1y https://bitinfocharts.com/comparison/bitcoin-fee_to_reward.h...
  - yieldcrv 3y ago
    thanks for the data, I stand corrected! I had read an exuberant twitter thread about ordinal inscriptions tl;dr the trend is up with spike periods of transaction fees making up 25 - 45% of the block reward. so with the exact same amount of activity after the next halving it will be 50 - 90%. that's a good indicator of network health and fulfilling its vision of the network sustaining itself after block rewards subside.

TacticalCoder 3y ago

> “Good luck cashing out those millions!” cashes out hundreds of millions I'm helping a non-tecchie with the technical details (she bought Bitcoin years ago, stored them on a Ledger with the help of someone, has no idea how to safely get them out / how to update her Ledger / etc.) and there's some truth to what you say but... In the EU at least it can be very difficult to cash out any sizeable amount. 10 K? Sure, fine. 10 millions and more? You go to a private bank and they'll be very interested in helping you out. But you have anywhere from a few hundred Ks to 2 or 3 millions: that's too small of a fry for a private bank and way too scary for people doing KYC/AML at regular consumer banks. I'm literally talking about banks kicking people out as soon as they mention they have 1 million+ in crypto. Put it this way: it's easier to cash out hundreds of millions than it is to cash out one million. It's all people working in banks/finance/funds around me and that subject comes out often. There are people who manage to cash out but there also people having lots of issues. Cashing out a sizeable amount is doable but it can definitely be very complicated. At least in the EU. P.S: btw I'm talking about ordinary people who did absolutely nothing wrong: they just made an ultra speculative (but legal) investment in Bitcoin and/or shitcoins which, on paper, paid off.

yieldcrv 3y ago
I know OTC desks that can handle that for competitive spreads but Coinbase also services the Eurozone and UK. they also have an OTC desk. all been easy for over half a decade. you dont mention that word to banks.
jbverschoor 3y ago
Well, here in the Netherlands, banks someone flag grocery transactions as suspicious with the result that average joe will have to provide evidence and all kind of crap to prevent his bank account from being closed. “CDD” If that happens, you’re cut off. No more insurance, banking, mortgage, nothing.