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Nice... Does the NHTSA have independent data to support the claim? Because if not, I'm taking this as PR masquerading as a data project

webel0 3y ago
Better NHTSA testing/benchmarks/regulations would help the entire industry at this point. After the cruise debacle, we need more than just, “our internal metrics show.”
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
happytiger 3y ago
You should imo. With cruise taking a nose dive, it’s clearly a priority to establish themselves as the “remaining alternative” in the marketplace. Especially given the problematic data that has emerged in this industry over the last few years. Consider that the entire article starts with, “Safety leads everything we do at Waymo.” A clear and almost painfully direct PR to what took down Cruise last week. You could almost add “unlike our competitors” to the headlines haha
bryanlarsen 3y ago
If they're lying and you can prove it, you can make a lot of money. Lying in a press release is securities fraud, and there are some nice whistleblower statutes that can give you a big payout.
- acdha 3y ago
  There’s a gap between outright fraud and analysis not making a completely accurate comparison. In this topic it’s tricky to make sure you’re comparing representative trips: for example, one study earlier this year found that Tesla's reported safety improvement disappeared after accounting for disparities in the age of the drivers, the type of driving, age of the vehicle, etc. – teenagers making bad choices cause a lot of crashes but the kind of people who buy a high-end car tend to be much older and are less likely to drive like that in any vehicle. Waymo is definitely saying things which look like they’re trying to compare apples to apples but it’s not hard to trip over data like this even if your intentions are fully honest. The fact that they’re publishing data and encouraging independent review is a good sign.
- ttfkam 3y ago
  Laughing in Elon Musk.
stevenjgarner 3y ago
Agree. The NHTSA Standing General Order (SGO) 2021 [1] requires reporting of crashes involving vehicles equipped with SAE Level 2 ADAS (Advanced Driver Assistance Systems) or higher when the system is engaged. However, the data only started being collected in June 2021, and my understanding is the NHTSA claims it's still too early to draw statistically significant conclusions. [1] https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/2023-04/Second-Amended-SGO-2021-01_2023-04-05_2.pdf https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/2023-04/Second-A...
Mageek 3y ago
NHTSA standing general order crash rates are a mandated and publicly available data source. That’s what the study is based on.

webel0 3y ago

Better NHTSA testing/benchmarks/regulations would help the entire industry at this point. After the cruise debacle, we need more than just, “our internal metrics show.”

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

happytiger 3y ago

You should imo. With cruise taking a nose dive, it’s clearly a priority to establish themselves as the “remaining alternative” in the marketplace. Especially given the problematic data that has emerged in this industry over the last few years. Consider that the entire article starts with, “Safety leads everything we do at Waymo.” A clear and almost painfully direct PR to what took down Cruise last week. You could almost add “unlike our competitors” to the headlines haha

bryanlarsen 3y ago

If they're lying and you can prove it, you can make a lot of money. Lying in a press release is securities fraud, and there are some nice whistleblower statutes that can give you a big payout.

acdha 3y ago
There’s a gap between outright fraud and analysis not making a completely accurate comparison. In this topic it’s tricky to make sure you’re comparing representative trips: for example, one study earlier this year found that Tesla's reported safety improvement disappeared after accounting for disparities in the age of the drivers, the type of driving, age of the vehicle, etc. – teenagers making bad choices cause a lot of crashes but the kind of people who buy a high-end car tend to be much older and are less likely to drive like that in any vehicle. Waymo is definitely saying things which look like they’re trying to compare apples to apples but it’s not hard to trip over data like this even if your intentions are fully honest. The fact that they’re publishing data and encouraging independent review is a good sign.
ttfkam 3y ago
Laughing in Elon Musk.

stevenjgarner 3y ago

Agree. The NHTSA Standing General Order (SGO) 2021 [1] requires reporting of crashes involving vehicles equipped with SAE Level 2 ADAS (Advanced Driver Assistance Systems) or higher when the system is engaged. However, the data only started being collected in June 2021, and my understanding is the NHTSA claims it's still too early to draw statistically significant conclusions. [1] https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/2023-04/Second-Amended-SGO-2021-01_2023-04-05_2.pdf https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/2023-04/Second-A...

Mageek 3y ago

NHTSA standing general order crash rates are a mandated and publicly available data source. That’s what the study is based on.