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>I live in NYC. The problem is that there’s literally 0 housing. That’s it. >Literally so many people want to move here, but you look on all of streeteasy on a

>I live in NYC. The problem is that there’s literally 0 housing. That’s it. >Literally so many people want to move here, but you look on all of streeteasy on a given day and there’s like 500 apartments. In a cities of millions. I'm currently in my mid-30's. Throughout all of my 20's, I thought it would be a blast to live in NYC. Then I had a good stretch where I visited it a whole bunch of times, hanging out with friends and family who lived there, and you know what I noticed? Unless you were an older family member who owned a home/apartment, every younger person was renting and the topic of conversation among locals, both locals who knew each other and locals who just met one another, was about where they're living, how much their rent is, what kind of battle they had to go through to get the place, what kind of battles their friends went through to get their places, and then they'd compare the different amenities they had or didn't have. I watched these same conversations - some of which were told like war stories - play out again and again and again and again. Then, you get into the whole issue of bed bugs, how prevalent they are in NYC and how much of a nightmare it is to deal with them, and you realize that life in NYC is largely spent just trying to figure out how to have a place to live, and it suddenly feels incredibly stupid to bother to try and move there. The nightlife and entertainment and culture, as cool as they are, just aren't worth it if you're constantly hassling with such a basic need. But that's just me. /shrug

wolverine876 3y ago
> life in NYC is largely spent just trying to figure out how to have a place to live There's a lot going on in NYC, possibly more than anywhere in the world. And in fact, that's why people want to move there.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
dotnet00 3y ago
Add in the considerations regarding moving every couple of years and doing it all over again. There's no long term stability to be had, so it's no wonder that people left when given the chance in the form of increased remote opportunities and a lifestyle "reset" in the form of covid.
- wolverine876 3y ago
  I think the story of NYC is people try it when they don't need stability. Some make it and get stability there, some don't and move on, and a new generation moves in. "If I can make it there, I'll make it anywhere ..." ..... And yes, we look the same Both pumping steel Both sweating But you know she got nothing to hide And I got something to hide here Called desire. I got something to hide here Called desire And I will get out of here You know that fear potion is just about to come In my nose is the taste of sugar And I got nothing to hide here Save desire And I'm going to go I'm going to get out of here I'm going to get out of here I'm going to get on that train And I'm going to go on that train And go to New York City I'm going to be somebody I'm getting Going to get on that train Go to New York City I'm going to be so big I'm going to be a big star And I will never return ...
waihtis 3y ago
plus many other places do the chaotic metropolitan vibe much better, e.g. London.
ahoy 3y ago
I moved here about 10 years ago in my mid 20s. It's certainly more expensive and annoying to find housing here than other places I've lived, but it's more than balanced out by needing to own an automobile. The average cost of car ownership in the US is in the $10k-12k range. I certainly don't spent an extra thousand dollars on rent here vs say, any other place I might reasonably move. So I figure I'm still coming out ahead. I can't speak to the bedbugs problem, I've been lucky I suppose.
- light_hue_1 3y ago
  Owning a car is far cheaper than living in NYC! You definitely spend more than $10-12k/year once you have a family for even a modest amount of space. And that's the average cost of car ownership, it's easy to find a cheap car.
  - steveBK123 3y ago
    Yes, $10-12k is like the monthly mortgage on a family sized apartment in NYC. Many NYers need to construct elaborate fantasies to delude themselves that actually living in NYC is totally economical/convenient/rational, and not just their personal preference. Something about a river in Egypt. In reality while it's fun, its also often inconvenient, expensive, or both.
  - geodel 3y ago
    Further car can be useful in lot of ways, like hauling large amount of things, groceries, going for a out of town trip and so on. I think in case of NYC don't need a car in city vs can't afford a car in city use cases are mixed and need to be separated out.
- steveBK123 3y ago
  NYC housing quality is, absolutely, dollar for dollar, garbage value. With or without discounting car costs. My (now) wife & I both got well paying jobs at banks out of college almost 20 years ago. Our entire signing bonuses went to apartment fees & deposits. We were each in a situation where 1 paycheck per month went to the rent. Neither of us had a dishwasher, let alone a washer/dryer, central air, any aircon.. etc. Our buildings had bugs&rats, and walls thin enough to hear neighbors phone calls. Marrying and moving up to nicer places, we still had no washer/dryer across the next 2 apartments. Finally when we felt like we had "made it" in our mid-30s, we bought a new condo and finally have a washer/dryer. It cost more than my parents, in-laws, and sister's homes combined.. and then multiplied by two. It has only 2 beds (not 3 like the aforementioned homes). My kitchen has a stove the size of a fisher price play kit, and the oven doesn't fit standard sized baking trays. I have only 1 zone AC which can't manage to keep the different rooms within +/-5F of each other. I could live like a proverbial king in 95% of the rest of the country on this budget.
mtalantikite 3y ago
>...the topic of conversation among locals, both locals who knew each other and locals who just met one another, was about where they're living, how much their rent is, what kind of battle they had to go through to get the place ... New Yorkers have been doing this for decades upon decades. When I moved here in the early 2000s I thought it was weird too, but it's totally normal to ask those sorts of questions of each other here. It's been difficult to "make it" here for as long as New York has been New York. My grandmother once told me towards the end of her life about how she and my grandfather had tried to live in NYC back after WWII and how hard it was, how they didn't last long. I didn't even know they had lived anywhere besides the Boston area until then.
- dfxm12 3y ago
  It's been the storyline of many sitcoms at least going back to at least the 90s set in Manhattan. The Andrea Doria episode of Seinfeld immediately comes to mind...
  - mtalantikite 3y ago
    "It was quite a fire"
lanewinfield 3y ago
I lived in NYC for 10 years (the majority of my 20s). Yes, people talk about their rent and their apartments (amongst many other things!), but it's because it's one of the things they all have in common— they rent. And because we loved to collectively complain about things. And not once in the 10 years did I have bed bugs. I think I knew one other person with them (barring I'm sure a few who never shared). All that being said, there is absolutely a housing shortage AND things in NYC are tougher than anywhere else. But I liken NYC to the doughnut added to the baseball bat when batters warm up— once you take it off (and live anywhere else) everything feels easier.
- steveBK123 3y ago
  Yes! I think the best single world description of NYC is - hard. It works ok in your 20s because you may not have pets/kids/ailing parents/etc to worry about. And you don't realize that you are treading water while your friends outside the city are moving onto more established phases of their lives..

wolverine876 3y ago

> life in NYC is largely spent just trying to figure out how to have a place to live There's a lot going on in NYC, possibly more than anywhere in the world. And in fact, that's why people want to move there.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]

dotnet00 3y ago

Add in the considerations regarding moving every couple of years and doing it all over again. There's no long term stability to be had, so it's no wonder that people left when given the chance in the form of increased remote opportunities and a lifestyle "reset" in the form of covid.

wolverine876 3y ago
I think the story of NYC is people try it when they don't need stability. Some make it and get stability there, some don't and move on, and a new generation moves in. "If I can make it there, I'll make it anywhere ..." ..... And yes, we look the same Both pumping steel Both sweating But you know she got nothing to hide And I got something to hide here Called desire. I got something to hide here Called desire And I will get out of here You know that fear potion is just about to come In my nose is the taste of sugar And I got nothing to hide here Save desire And I'm going to go I'm going to get out of here I'm going to get out of here I'm going to get on that train And I'm going to go on that train And go to New York City I'm going to be somebody I'm getting Going to get on that train Go to New York City I'm going to be so big I'm going to be a big star And I will never return ...

waihtis 3y ago

plus many other places do the chaotic metropolitan vibe much better, e.g. London.

ahoy 3y ago

I moved here about 10 years ago in my mid 20s. It's certainly more expensive and annoying to find housing here than other places I've lived, but it's more than balanced out by needing to own an automobile. The average cost of car ownership in the US is in the $10k-12k range. I certainly don't spent an extra thousand dollars on rent here vs say, any other place I might reasonably move. So I figure I'm still coming out ahead. I can't speak to the bedbugs problem, I've been lucky I suppose.

light_hue_1 3y ago
Owning a car is far cheaper than living in NYC! You definitely spend more than $10-12k/year once you have a family for even a modest amount of space. And that's the average cost of car ownership, it's easy to find a cheap car.
- steveBK123 3y ago
  Yes, $10-12k is like the monthly mortgage on a family sized apartment in NYC. Many NYers need to construct elaborate fantasies to delude themselves that actually living in NYC is totally economical/convenient/rational, and not just their personal preference. Something about a river in Egypt. In reality while it's fun, its also often inconvenient, expensive, or both.
- geodel 3y ago
  Further car can be useful in lot of ways, like hauling large amount of things, groceries, going for a out of town trip and so on. I think in case of NYC don't need a car in city vs can't afford a car in city use cases are mixed and need to be separated out.
steveBK123 3y ago
NYC housing quality is, absolutely, dollar for dollar, garbage value. With or without discounting car costs. My (now) wife & I both got well paying jobs at banks out of college almost 20 years ago. Our entire signing bonuses went to apartment fees & deposits. We were each in a situation where 1 paycheck per month went to the rent. Neither of us had a dishwasher, let alone a washer/dryer, central air, any aircon.. etc. Our buildings had bugs&rats, and walls thin enough to hear neighbors phone calls. Marrying and moving up to nicer places, we still had no washer/dryer across the next 2 apartments. Finally when we felt like we had "made it" in our mid-30s, we bought a new condo and finally have a washer/dryer. It cost more than my parents, in-laws, and sister's homes combined.. and then multiplied by two. It has only 2 beds (not 3 like the aforementioned homes). My kitchen has a stove the size of a fisher price play kit, and the oven doesn't fit standard sized baking trays. I have only 1 zone AC which can't manage to keep the different rooms within +/-5F of each other. I could live like a proverbial king in 95% of the rest of the country on this budget.

mtalantikite 3y ago

>...the topic of conversation among locals, both locals who knew each other and locals who just met one another, was about where they're living, how much their rent is, what kind of battle they had to go through to get the place ... New Yorkers have been doing this for decades upon decades. When I moved here in the early 2000s I thought it was weird too, but it's totally normal to ask those sorts of questions of each other here. It's been difficult to "make it" here for as long as New York has been New York. My grandmother once told me towards the end of her life about how she and my grandfather had tried to live in NYC back after WWII and how hard it was, how they didn't last long. I didn't even know they had lived anywhere besides the Boston area until then.

dfxm12 3y ago
It's been the storyline of many sitcoms at least going back to at least the 90s set in Manhattan. The Andrea Doria episode of Seinfeld immediately comes to mind...
- mtalantikite 3y ago
  "It was quite a fire"

lanewinfield 3y ago

I lived in NYC for 10 years (the majority of my 20s). Yes, people talk about their rent and their apartments (amongst many other things!), but it's because it's one of the things they all have in common— they rent. And because we loved to collectively complain about things. And not once in the 10 years did I have bed bugs. I think I knew one other person with them (barring I'm sure a few who never shared). All that being said, there is absolutely a housing shortage AND things in NYC are tougher than anywhere else. But I liken NYC to the doughnut added to the baseball bat when batters warm up— once you take it off (and live anywhere else) everything feels easier.

steveBK123 3y ago
Yes! I think the best single world description of NYC is - hard. It works ok in your 20s because you may not have pets/kids/ailing parents/etc to worry about. And you don't realize that you are treading water while your friends outside the city are moving onto more established phases of their lives..