> I wonder if there is a generally accepted quantifiable definition of programming language expressiveness. If there is such a definition it would not fit into

> I wonder if there is a generally accepted quantifiable definition of programming language expressiveness. If there is such a definition it would not fit into these sorts of conversations. I love Ruby but every time I see someone mention Ruby "expressiveness" it is never mentioned as a subjective fact like syntax feature count. Instead it is always closely tied to emotional feeling, assumptions, and intuition. "Ruby's expressiveness means it just gets out of the way and lets me code." I've probably said that myself a hundred times. OTOH it is great for DSLs and metaprogramming, gives a taste of what the LISPers have always had. Maybe that is a good definition of "expressive". [edit: added thought about DSLs]