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Isn't this just "Fake it until you make it"? I don't personally believe people should do this, but it is a mantra often thrown around.

hef19898 3y ago
And it basically is fraud. That fraud is easier to prove if the result is failong and not making it.
jjeaff 3y ago
I guess so. But I've never thought this was the true spirit of that phrase. To me, fake it till you make it means to pretend you know what you are doing until you do.
happytiger 3y ago
The “fake it till you make it” strategy is more about changing your behavior to project confidence when you don’t feel you should have any or the social situation wouldn’t necessarily support it. This is fundamentally lying to investors when you have a fiduciary responsibility beyond your own enrichment. This isn’t some suggestion either, but law. Obviously we can debate the effectiveness of the law. But generally you are expected to “be square” in your dealings. https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/fiduciary-responsibility-corporations.html https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/fiduciary-responsibi...
- lazide 3y ago
  There is solid precedent that it depends on what the definition of ‘is’ is. /s
rtsil 3y ago
I take it prosecutors are far more lenient when you're faking a phone UI to always show a full signal or surreptitiously switch to a new phone before the previous one runs out of memory and needs a restart, rather than pretending a 20-ton killing machine can drive itself up a hill.
- Nextgrid 3y ago
  I think the most important differentiator is who gets fleeced. In the case of the phone, average Joes get stuffed. In Nikola's cases, rich people got stuffed. That's why this gets prosecuted fairly quickly, while corporations regularly committing fraud against consumers remain in business for decades.
  - bsdpufferfish 3y ago
    This is also why everyone has heard about Theranos.
comfysocks 3y ago
Maybe it’s an example of “fake it ‘till you make it” that crossed the line into fraud? For example, when puffing up one’s CV, one could probably get away with making an actual accomplishment seem more important than it is. However, if they were to make up the accomplishment whole-cloth, the that would cross a line.

hef19898 3y ago

And it basically is fraud. That fraud is easier to prove if the result is failong and not making it.

jjeaff 3y ago

I guess so. But I've never thought this was the true spirit of that phrase. To me, fake it till you make it means to pretend you know what you are doing until you do.

happytiger 3y ago

The “fake it till you make it” strategy is more about changing your behavior to project confidence when you don’t feel you should have any or the social situation wouldn’t necessarily support it. This is fundamentally lying to investors when you have a fiduciary responsibility beyond your own enrichment. This isn’t some suggestion either, but law. Obviously we can debate the effectiveness of the law. But generally you are expected to “be square” in your dealings. https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/fiduciary-responsibility-corporations.html https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/fiduciary-responsibi...

lazide 3y ago
There is solid precedent that it depends on what the definition of ‘is’ is. /s

rtsil 3y ago

I take it prosecutors are far more lenient when you're faking a phone UI to always show a full signal or surreptitiously switch to a new phone before the previous one runs out of memory and needs a restart, rather than pretending a 20-ton killing machine can drive itself up a hill.

Nextgrid 3y ago
I think the most important differentiator is who gets fleeced. In the case of the phone, average Joes get stuffed. In Nikola's cases, rich people got stuffed. That's why this gets prosecuted fairly quickly, while corporations regularly committing fraud against consumers remain in business for decades.
- bsdpufferfish 3y ago
  This is also why everyone has heard about Theranos.

comfysocks 3y ago

Maybe it’s an example of “fake it ‘till you make it” that crossed the line into fraud? For example, when puffing up one’s CV, one could probably get away with making an actual accomplishment seem more important than it is. However, if they were to make up the accomplishment whole-cloth, the that would cross a line.