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This is a really neat one. I think the only part that should be more nuanced is > systemd is written to deliberately (ab)use every single non-portable extensio

This is a really neat one. I think the only part that should be more nuanced is > systemd is written to deliberately (ab)use every single non-portable extension under the sun I think this should be split into 2 parts. Linux specific kernel features and userspace extensions (GNU vs. POSIX). Using linux specific kernel features (like cgroups) is good for a linux system. E.g. a common issue with sshd used to be that under high load it would become slow and problematic to log in. Systemd configures the system such that this becomes less likely to happen. For userspace extensions I would have hoped that systemd would see it as a net positive to build upon a smaller set of tools and features, but the page seems to indicate otherwise. Does anyone know what happened on that front?

q66 3y ago
that part refers solely to gratuitous use of extensions in the code, it does not refer to things like cgroups for which there are no portable equivalents, or anything else that is required to implement useful functionality and has no portable counterparts
LeFantome 3y ago
As a selfish user, I see taking full advantage of all the features of the kernel as a good thing. OCI container support is one of the things that keeps me so firmly planted in the Linux ecosystem. Outside the kernel, calling into non-portable extensions should only be done with good reason. One of my favourite things about Chimera is its rejection of most of the GNU specific ecosystem. Actually, I do not like GNU specific stuff in the kernel either. It should be possible to compile the kernel with multiple compilers. Ironically, with the addition of Rust in the kernel, most distributions will have to use both LLVM and GCC to create a kernel whereas Chimera can use LLVM for both. Hopefully by the time important Rust code starts to ship in Linux, GCC will have a proper Rust front-end. I am all for one “most popular” Linux distro that new users can be directed to and that commercial interests can support. Linux ubiquity is being held back by “fragmentation” in that way. That said, I want the ability for myself to choose other ways of doing things ( knowing the convenience I am giving up to do so ). I want focussed projects to be able to innovate. Even if we have a “most popular” option, I do not want a mono-culture. You can have an all systemd system. It can be the norm. Please do not take away my ability to do something else. At least, do not do it without a good reason.

q66 3y ago

that part refers solely to gratuitous use of extensions in the code, it does not refer to things like cgroups for which there are no portable equivalents, or anything else that is required to implement useful functionality and has no portable counterparts

LeFantome 3y ago

As a selfish user, I see taking full advantage of all the features of the kernel as a good thing. OCI container support is one of the things that keeps me so firmly planted in the Linux ecosystem. Outside the kernel, calling into non-portable extensions should only be done with good reason. One of my favourite things about Chimera is its rejection of most of the GNU specific ecosystem. Actually, I do not like GNU specific stuff in the kernel either. It should be possible to compile the kernel with multiple compilers. Ironically, with the addition of Rust in the kernel, most distributions will have to use both LLVM and GCC to create a kernel whereas Chimera can use LLVM for both. Hopefully by the time important Rust code starts to ship in Linux, GCC will have a proper Rust front-end. I am all for one “most popular” Linux distro that new users can be directed to and that commercial interests can support. Linux ubiquity is being held back by “fragmentation” in that way. That said, I want the ability for myself to choose other ways of doing things ( knowing the convenience I am giving up to do so ). I want focussed projects to be able to innovate. Even if we have a “most popular” option, I do not want a mono-culture. You can have an all systemd system. It can be the norm. Please do not take away my ability to do something else. At least, do not do it without a good reason.