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Agreed. I heard a story about a guy who is used to chewing tobacco while driving and would crack open the door and spit while moving at speed. He tried doing

Agreed. I heard a story about a guy who is used to chewing tobacco while driving and would crack open the door and spit while moving at speed. He tried doing this in his son's new jeep and the car immediately slammed on the brakes and nearly caused an accident. Obviously cracking the door to spit out the bottom isn't too safe but slamming on the brakes? What why?

Cacti 3y ago
What exactly is the issue? That the guy has been recklessly opening his car door, while driving it, at speed, for his entire life?
- peteradio 3y ago
  The issue is that its not safe to activate the emergency brake at highway speeds. It seems like an anti-safety feature.
  - ceejayoz 3y ago
    Isn’t it recommended in a brake failure situation? Car to neutral, engage emergency brake.
    - peteradio 3y ago
      That's an emergency maneuver where you are trying to land an out of control vehicle, don't really see how it applies to the above scenario. So no its still not safe but neither is having no brakes.
      - ceejayoz 3y ago
        A door opening on the highway is an emergency scenario, too. The car is correct to go “what the fuck?!”
        freedomben 3y ago
        I wonder if this is a cultural difference. When I was a kid, because people did this all the time for various reasons. It's less common now (or at least, in the circle of people who ride in my car it is), especially with better door ajar sensors, but still a situation in which if it happened in my car I would guess the door hadn't been shut all the way and they were just closing it. As a teenager/20s in the 90s/00s, having tobacco spit and realizing you forgot your cup was a semi-common reason to do that. The alternative (assuming you weren't so classless as to spit on the floormat) was to swallow the spit which is really terrible for you.
        adgjlsfhk1 3y ago
        what about windows?
        freedomben 3y ago
        Everyone tries the window at least once :-D Unless you are truly an expert spitter and the car is not moving, then spitting out the window is going to end up streaking the tobacco juice all across the exterior of the car. If the rear window is open, it might even go onto the back seat of the car. If you aren't moving then it will usually land somewhat vertically on the body of the car, or straight back (horizontally) if you're moving fast. It's always super tempting to try, but nearly impossible to pull off
        serf 3y ago
        it's not a great habit, but i've routinely witnessed people in sports cars crack the door open for additional clearance to manipulate their belts or adjust their seats, then quickly re-closing the door -- my point being that this kind of thing isn't absolutely exclusive to people chewing tobacco, and the car stomping the brakes or whatever is clearly under-thought.
        peteradio 3y ago
        Couldn't disagree more. Slamming on the brakes is an absolute last ditch maneuver at speed and shouldn't come about because the car gets a lil confused.
  - bagels 3y ago
    I read a little about this system on jeeps. It seems to only happen under 1 mph, and stems from previous novel (faulty ux) shifter designs that led people to be run over by their own cars.
    - Cacti 3y ago
      This is what we experienced with our Jeep. The only times it’s gone off is when pulling in or out, and it’s very rare. It is hard to believe the OPs story is entirely true, or wasn’t exaggerated. More like the guy spilled some dip on himself while pulling out of the garage (because of the sudden halt) and it eventually turned into a “honey, i’m serious, I almost died” story because they were so embarrassed.
  - grepfru_it 3y ago
    The issue is someone is used to the way an old system operated and expects a new system to operate the same way. My mother has no clue that the spinning circle is a "system thinking" icon, but if it were an hourglass it would make immediate sense. News at 11.
- xbar 3y ago
  Undocumented, non-standard, life-threatening software automation is bad?
  - Cacti 3y ago
    No, it’s documented. Thoroughly. It’s just that it’s a new car and the guy assumed there were no changes, and he didn’t check, and his son didn’t tell him. End of story. Also, this is an adult. With grownish children. They are old enough to know the risk of OPENING THE DRIVERS DOOR AT 70 MPH, and it is no one’s responsibility to account for that, and the guy should know by now that even if it worked 10,000,000,000 times before, it is inherently risky and dangerous, and it will always be inherently risky and dangerous. Like, the risk to reward ratio here is categorically insane. Use a cup, or maybe die? And they chose maybe die? And that’s a problem with the car? Huh?
    - Lanolderen 3y ago
      I don't see it being that dangerous. He's likely just pushing it slightly open with his left forearm automatically and taking his eyes off the road just for the second he needs to spit his tobacco out. If something happens the moment he stops actively pushing the wind will close it and he's likely strapped with a seatbelt so it's not like he can somehow fall out. I've had to re-close my door at speed multiple times on old vehicles because I didn't close it hard enough and it was never sketchy in any way. Doing literally anything on a touchscreen takes more attention. And the documented part is BS. People don't read their owners manuals and even if they did it'd usually say not to open the door in motion, not that it will slam the brakes if you do. Even if it does it's unrealistic to expect people to read the manual of every car they drive. Rentals would go out of business real quick.
- alistairSH 3y ago
  Slamming on the brakes seems like an over-reaction. Nobody is arguing opening the door at speed is safe, but an unexpected brake application isn't safe either. A more appropriate measure would be a loud and annoying alarm. Or a steering wheel shaker (like many lane-keeping systems already have).
dboreham 3y ago
Because that's gross?
- serf 3y ago
  i'd rather people break personal habits without involving the rest of the highway.
WirelessGigabit 3y ago
If that functionality was around sooner we wouldn't have lost Antony Yelchin.
- oblio 3y ago
  Technically I think they fixed this by having cars auto-shift from N to P if the car is not moved for longer than N seconds.
FireBeyond 3y ago
Paramedic here. We have to restrain all of our psych/behavioral patients, even ones who are calm, cooperative, medicated, and are really just being moved from facility to facility. Why? Because someone at some point has attempted to exit a vehicle moving at speed.

Cacti 3y ago

What exactly is the issue? That the guy has been recklessly opening his car door, while driving it, at speed, for his entire life?

peteradio 3y ago
The issue is that its not safe to activate the emergency brake at highway speeds. It seems like an anti-safety feature.
- ceejayoz 3y ago
  Isn’t it recommended in a brake failure situation? Car to neutral, engage emergency brake.
  - peteradio 3y ago
    That's an emergency maneuver where you are trying to land an out of control vehicle, don't really see how it applies to the above scenario. So no its still not safe but neither is having no brakes.
    - ceejayoz 3y ago
      A door opening on the highway is an emergency scenario, too. The car is correct to go “what the fuck?!”
      - freedomben 3y ago
        I wonder if this is a cultural difference. When I was a kid, because people did this all the time for various reasons. It's less common now (or at least, in the circle of people who ride in my car it is), especially with better door ajar sensors, but still a situation in which if it happened in my car I would guess the door hadn't been shut all the way and they were just closing it. As a teenager/20s in the 90s/00s, having tobacco spit and realizing you forgot your cup was a semi-common reason to do that. The alternative (assuming you weren't so classless as to spit on the floormat) was to swallow the spit which is really terrible for you.
        adgjlsfhk1 3y ago
        what about windows?
        freedomben 3y ago
        Everyone tries the window at least once :-D Unless you are truly an expert spitter and the car is not moving, then spitting out the window is going to end up streaking the tobacco juice all across the exterior of the car. If the rear window is open, it might even go onto the back seat of the car. If you aren't moving then it will usually land somewhat vertically on the body of the car, or straight back (horizontally) if you're moving fast. It's always super tempting to try, but nearly impossible to pull off
        serf 3y ago
        it's not a great habit, but i've routinely witnessed people in sports cars crack the door open for additional clearance to manipulate their belts or adjust their seats, then quickly re-closing the door -- my point being that this kind of thing isn't absolutely exclusive to people chewing tobacco, and the car stomping the brakes or whatever is clearly under-thought.
      - peteradio 3y ago
        Couldn't disagree more. Slamming on the brakes is an absolute last ditch maneuver at speed and shouldn't come about because the car gets a lil confused.
- bagels 3y ago
  I read a little about this system on jeeps. It seems to only happen under 1 mph, and stems from previous novel (faulty ux) shifter designs that led people to be run over by their own cars.
  - Cacti 3y ago
    This is what we experienced with our Jeep. The only times it’s gone off is when pulling in or out, and it’s very rare. It is hard to believe the OPs story is entirely true, or wasn’t exaggerated. More like the guy spilled some dip on himself while pulling out of the garage (because of the sudden halt) and it eventually turned into a “honey, i’m serious, I almost died” story because they were so embarrassed.
- grepfru_it 3y ago
  The issue is someone is used to the way an old system operated and expects a new system to operate the same way. My mother has no clue that the spinning circle is a "system thinking" icon, but if it were an hourglass it would make immediate sense. News at 11.
xbar 3y ago
Undocumented, non-standard, life-threatening software automation is bad?
- Cacti 3y ago
  No, it’s documented. Thoroughly. It’s just that it’s a new car and the guy assumed there were no changes, and he didn’t check, and his son didn’t tell him. End of story. Also, this is an adult. With grownish children. They are old enough to know the risk of OPENING THE DRIVERS DOOR AT 70 MPH, and it is no one’s responsibility to account for that, and the guy should know by now that even if it worked 10,000,000,000 times before, it is inherently risky and dangerous, and it will always be inherently risky and dangerous. Like, the risk to reward ratio here is categorically insane. Use a cup, or maybe die? And they chose maybe die? And that’s a problem with the car? Huh?
  - Lanolderen 3y ago
    I don't see it being that dangerous. He's likely just pushing it slightly open with his left forearm automatically and taking his eyes off the road just for the second he needs to spit his tobacco out. If something happens the moment he stops actively pushing the wind will close it and he's likely strapped with a seatbelt so it's not like he can somehow fall out. I've had to re-close my door at speed multiple times on old vehicles because I didn't close it hard enough and it was never sketchy in any way. Doing literally anything on a touchscreen takes more attention. And the documented part is BS. People don't read their owners manuals and even if they did it'd usually say not to open the door in motion, not that it will slam the brakes if you do. Even if it does it's unrealistic to expect people to read the manual of every car they drive. Rentals would go out of business real quick.
alistairSH 3y ago
Slamming on the brakes seems like an over-reaction. Nobody is arguing opening the door at speed is safe, but an unexpected brake application isn't safe either. A more appropriate measure would be a loud and annoying alarm. Or a steering wheel shaker (like many lane-keeping systems already have).

dboreham 3y ago

Because that's gross?

serf 3y ago
i'd rather people break personal habits without involving the rest of the highway.

WirelessGigabit 3y ago

If that functionality was around sooner we wouldn't have lost Antony Yelchin.

oblio 3y ago
Technically I think they fixed this by having cars auto-shift from N to P if the car is not moved for longer than N seconds.

FireBeyond 3y ago

Paramedic here. We have to restrain all of our psych/behavioral patients, even ones who are calm, cooperative, medicated, and are really just being moved from facility to facility. Why? Because someone at some point has attempted to exit a vehicle moving at speed.