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On the other hand, two orders of magnitude lower development costs for the dragon than for the space shuttle is phenomenal. Do you think NASA could do the same?

On the other hand, two orders of magnitude lower development costs for the dragon than for the space shuttle is phenomenal. Do you think NASA could do the same? I don't. Libertarians certainly have something to crow about! It's amazing how much more can be accomplished by a private, selfish actor compared to a selfless government agency with the same resources.

davidw 15y ago
> Libertarians certainly have something to crow about! It's amazing how much more can be accomplished by a private, selfish actor compared to a selfless government agency with the same resources. Once the basic research and exploration has been done, certainly. It's as if different kinds of organizations were both good at doing different kinds of things, and both worthy of a place in society...
- iRobot 15y ago
  Its a rocket. The basic research was done by the Germans at the end of WW2 and dont forget Russia, they got there first. Nasa wasnt even around then.
  - TeMPOraL 15y ago
    > Its a rocket. It's not just a rocket, it's a rocket capable of reaching orbit and returning [1]. But the things that NASA (along with russian space agency and others) did was things like figuring out, e.g., reliable ground-orbit radio communication, deployment and use of satellites, and a hell of procedures regarding pretty much everything from setting up a spacecraft, to lauching it, to orbiting, deorbiting and landing it, not to mention occasional orbital transfers to other planets. And let's not even get started about ground-side logistics. There is LOT more to a space mission than just building a rocket. NASA and others did a fine job of doing that, and building neccessary experience in the process. [1] - yeah, I know, ICBMs can do that too.
  - hahainternet 15y ago
    If the basic research was done by the Germans, what was all the research at NASA about? Libertarians virtually never have valid points, private industry efficiency is one of the most common urban myths. The incentive for efficiency is valid, but the efficacy and safety issues almost always outweigh it. I'm excited for the future of private spaceflight, but I am hoping that this allows NASA to contract for cheaper launches while maintaining their scientific research ability. What private company could survive the Hubble debacle, for example?
  - davidw 15y ago
    I would hope that even the most ardent libertarian would concede there are some technical differences between lobbing explosives across the English Channel, and sending a man to the moon and bringing him home again.
- jacoblyles 15y ago
  Sure, you have a point. But the Dragon still cost less to develop than a single launch of the NASA space shuttle. That's remarkable. It's a pretty good day to be a libertarian.
  - davidw 15y ago
    > But the Dragon still cost less to develop than a single launch of the NASA space shuttle. That's remarkable. It's called "standing on the shoulders of giants". I'm glad the industry is at a point where it can be run by companies instead of governments, as I'm sure it will be more efficient, and likely innovative as well. But those of us without an ideological axe to grind are pointing out that it got to this point thanks in no small part to government involvement.

davidw 15y ago

> Libertarians certainly have something to crow about! It's amazing how much more can be accomplished by a private, selfish actor compared to a selfless government agency with the same resources. Once the basic research and exploration has been done, certainly. It's as if different kinds of organizations were both good at doing different kinds of things, and both worthy of a place in society...

iRobot 15y ago
Its a rocket. The basic research was done by the Germans at the end of WW2 and dont forget Russia, they got there first. Nasa wasnt even around then.
- TeMPOraL 15y ago
  > Its a rocket. It's not just a rocket, it's a rocket capable of reaching orbit and returning [1]. But the things that NASA (along with russian space agency and others) did was things like figuring out, e.g., reliable ground-orbit radio communication, deployment and use of satellites, and a hell of procedures regarding pretty much everything from setting up a spacecraft, to lauching it, to orbiting, deorbiting and landing it, not to mention occasional orbital transfers to other planets. And let's not even get started about ground-side logistics. There is LOT more to a space mission than just building a rocket. NASA and others did a fine job of doing that, and building neccessary experience in the process. [1] - yeah, I know, ICBMs can do that too.
- hahainternet 15y ago
  If the basic research was done by the Germans, what was all the research at NASA about? Libertarians virtually never have valid points, private industry efficiency is one of the most common urban myths. The incentive for efficiency is valid, but the efficacy and safety issues almost always outweigh it. I'm excited for the future of private spaceflight, but I am hoping that this allows NASA to contract for cheaper launches while maintaining their scientific research ability. What private company could survive the Hubble debacle, for example?
- davidw 15y ago
  I would hope that even the most ardent libertarian would concede there are some technical differences between lobbing explosives across the English Channel, and sending a man to the moon and bringing him home again.
jacoblyles 15y ago
Sure, you have a point. But the Dragon still cost less to develop than a single launch of the NASA space shuttle. That's remarkable. It's a pretty good day to be a libertarian.
- davidw 15y ago
  > But the Dragon still cost less to develop than a single launch of the NASA space shuttle. That's remarkable. It's called "standing on the shoulders of giants". I'm glad the industry is at a point where it can be run by companies instead of governments, as I'm sure it will be more efficient, and likely innovative as well. But those of us without an ideological axe to grind are pointing out that it got to this point thanks in no small part to government involvement.