5 ms·

I'm not convinced that pharma or bio patents are justified, either. >Strategically, you don't want those drug people as enemies. Oh, actually, yes, can we ple

I'm not convinced that pharma or bio patents are justified, either. >Strategically, you don't want those drug people as enemies. Oh, actually, yes, can we please ream the m*****f*****s already? To talk about a group of people like that, suggests that they wield far too much power. It gets worse when you learn about what they actually do. Enough already. An "extremely powerful lobby" is not so scary when you outlaw the type of corporate lobbying they engage in. And the American people don't have to let you have a business.

Pxtl 3y ago
Without drug patents drug discovery would completely stop. I'm not averse to looking at alternative models for providing revenue to the drug discovery and testing infrastructure (the current model of patents is flawed as hell), but if you like new medications like the COVID vaccines then you have to respect the important of protecting the incentive to create them.
- senderista 3y ago
  The whole premise is flawed. Drug research is a public good and should be publicly funded. Private funding horribly distorts incentives (only drugs that are lucrative enough to recoup R&D costs are funded).
- underlipton 3y ago
  >Without drug patents drug discovery would completely stop. I don't believe that, but I won't convince you. Instead, I invite you to try to convince yourself. Imagine a world where drug discovery happens without patents. Talk it out, falsify your propositions as you go, see if you can come up with something workable.
  - Pxtl 3y ago
    I don't doubt that a workable alternative could be invented (and could improve on the deep flaws in the drug patent system), but it would be absolutely necessary to implement that alternative before removing the drug patent system. "Remove the drug patent system" = Upset Kanye "Replace the drug patent system with a new way to encourage drug discovery besides the honor system" = Smiling Kanye
    - underlipton 3y ago
      You can use an intermediary and (quickly) transition. I'm not concerned about preserving economic value or whatever, just research and expertise. It would be nice to get this done before a crisis that tests the system (again).
AlbertCory 3y ago
ok, bro. 100% or nothing? Guess which one you'll get?
- underlipton 3y ago
  Under the current system, it's already effectively "nothing" for >People who can't afford existing drugs >People who can't get corporations to develop drugs for their conditions because they wouldn't be "profitable" >People who can't make their farm's business model work even though they're fully capable of growing the crops people want and getting them to market and so on. But thank you for being my daily encounter with Better Things Aren't Possible Guy.
  - AlbertCory 3y ago
    wishful thinking's always better than facing reality. At least in some worlds.
    - underlipton 3y ago
      Pessimists don't have a monopoly on reality, and society isn't obligated to limit itself to your low expectations just so that you can feel good about being right. Face the reality that the status quo is unsustainable. Throw off your wishful thinking that things can go on like this without repercussion.
      - AlbertCory 3y ago
        rather than me wasting even more time responding, why don't you go forth and pursue your all-encompassing patent solution, and report back on how it went?
        underlipton 3y ago
        And so we circle back around to the character of the status quo, where powerful lobbying groups have made it untenable to do anything without just straight-up murking them first. I suppose your suggestion was right: it truly is "100% or nothing." I appreciate your endorsement for the campaign to completely wreck these people's livelihoods for the greater good of society. Hope to see you on the front lines.

Pxtl 3y ago

Without drug patents drug discovery would completely stop. I'm not averse to looking at alternative models for providing revenue to the drug discovery and testing infrastructure (the current model of patents is flawed as hell), but if you like new medications like the COVID vaccines then you have to respect the important of protecting the incentive to create them.

senderista 3y ago
The whole premise is flawed. Drug research is a public good and should be publicly funded. Private funding horribly distorts incentives (only drugs that are lucrative enough to recoup R&D costs are funded).
underlipton 3y ago
>Without drug patents drug discovery would completely stop. I don't believe that, but I won't convince you. Instead, I invite you to try to convince yourself. Imagine a world where drug discovery happens without patents. Talk it out, falsify your propositions as you go, see if you can come up with something workable.
- Pxtl 3y ago
  I don't doubt that a workable alternative could be invented (and could improve on the deep flaws in the drug patent system), but it would be absolutely necessary to implement that alternative before removing the drug patent system. "Remove the drug patent system" = Upset Kanye "Replace the drug patent system with a new way to encourage drug discovery besides the honor system" = Smiling Kanye
  - underlipton 3y ago
    You can use an intermediary and (quickly) transition. I'm not concerned about preserving economic value or whatever, just research and expertise. It would be nice to get this done before a crisis that tests the system (again).

AlbertCory 3y ago

ok, bro. 100% or nothing? Guess which one you'll get?

underlipton 3y ago
Under the current system, it's already effectively "nothing" for >People who can't afford existing drugs >People who can't get corporations to develop drugs for their conditions because they wouldn't be "profitable" >People who can't make their farm's business model work even though they're fully capable of growing the crops people want and getting them to market and so on. But thank you for being my daily encounter with Better Things Aren't Possible Guy.
- AlbertCory 3y ago
  wishful thinking's always better than facing reality. At least in some worlds.
  - underlipton 3y ago
    Pessimists don't have a monopoly on reality, and society isn't obligated to limit itself to your low expectations just so that you can feel good about being right. Face the reality that the status quo is unsustainable. Throw off your wishful thinking that things can go on like this without repercussion.
    - AlbertCory 3y ago
      rather than me wasting even more time responding, why don't you go forth and pursue your all-encompassing patent solution, and report back on how it went?
      - underlipton 3y ago
        And so we circle back around to the character of the status quo, where powerful lobbying groups have made it untenable to do anything without just straight-up murking them first. I suppose your suggestion was right: it truly is "100% or nothing." I appreciate your endorsement for the campaign to completely wreck these people's livelihoods for the greater good of society. Hope to see you on the front lines.