6 ms·

AuroraStore is very close, using a ton of reverse engineered stuff from the play store It should all totally be open though

xethos 3y ago
By that measure, F-Droid is very close in that both have the majority of apps some people use (Aurora for you, F-Droid for me). Neither can compete with the Play store though, as only Google's offering is allowed to update or install apps in the background without user interaction (without root). For that matter, only Google Play Protect (part of the Play Store IIRC) can uninstall apps from user's devices with no interaction.
- johnnyanmac 3y ago
  >only Google Play Protect (part of the Play Store IIRC) can uninstall apps from user's devices with no interaction. That sounds horrible. Why can a store decide to delete an app with no prior notice? But it does seem Google has given more freedom to other apps to install apps. I guess it comes down to if that's still too many clicks or too fear mongering to count as "competitive".
  - Psychotherapist 3y ago
    In my experience Google Play Protect can be disabled, and shows a warning an app might be "Harmful" and sometimes prompts to Uninstall or Ignore the warning, afaik no unprompted uninstalls
  - ayewo 3y ago
    It’s a security feature. They’ve had this feature for more than a decade [1]. It allows them to remotely remove any malicious app from Android devices without any user intervention. 1: https://www.computerworld.com/article/2752902/google-remotely-removes-android-apps.amp.html https://www.computerworld.com/article/2752902/google-remotel...
    - mminer237 3y ago
      Worse than that, I've had it unilaterally block legitimate third-party apps I've installed from F-Droid. Then since I've disabled it, it constantly nags me to re-enable it so it can re-delete my third-party apps. If you want to talk about anti-competitive, Play "Protect" should be where you start.
- noisem4ker 3y ago
  > only Google's offering is allowed to update or install apps in the background Not anymore, since Android 12 (2021). https://www.xda-developers.com/android-12-alternative-app-stores-update-apps-background/ https://www.xda-developers.com/android-12-alternative-app-st...
  - xethos 3y ago
    You're right! I thought I'd heard something about that, but couldn't quite remember :) From your linked article though: > in response to mounting pressure from Epic Games and government regulators Just because it came out before the judgement doesn't mean it wasn't because of the court case. And frankly, needing to be sued to do the not-a-monopoly thing isn't exactly a great look. Maybe I'm just grouchy because I'll never get to use it though - BlackBerry stopped making handsets, so I'm using either the last great physical keyboard (subjective, but true IMO) while being "stuck" on Android 8.1, or GNU+Linux à la Pinephone Pro.
harrygeez 3y ago
I don't fully understand. Are these functionalities baked into Android that only allow Play Store to use it?
- bogwog 3y ago
  Pretty much. Google Play services runs as like a root process that can (among other things) bypass all the security checks that the OS usually has. That includes those annoying update confirmation dialogs which make it impossible to install updates automatically without user interaction.
  - LoganDark 3y ago
    Specifically GMS runs as a "privileged app" (that's what priv-apps stands for) which can declare access to permissions in the manifest that non-privileged apps can't even ask for.
    - UncleMeat 3y ago
      Importantly, this is largely a property of preloaded apps rather than GMS explicitly.
      - LoganDark 3y ago
        Yeah, they are curated by the author(s) of the Android build that the device is running.
  - jacooper 3y ago
    > That includes those annoying update confirmation dialogs which make it impossible to install updates automatically without user interaction. Important to note this has changed starting with android 12, now you just need accept installing the app, and the source can update the app without interaction. Droidify (third party fdroid client) supports it, among others like Aurora store.
  - jacooper 3y ago
dredmorbius 3y ago
AFAIU Aurora isn't an alternate store, but an alternate front-end to the Google Play Store. That is, the only apps available through Aurora are those on Google Play, and if Google's rejected an app, then you won't be able to install it via Aurora. By contrast, F-Droid is an alternative front-end and app store, with apps available which aren't included in Google Play (for example, Termux). (I use both Aurora and F-Droid on an Onyx Android device.)
DeathArrow 3y ago
You can install and run apps from Aurora store without having Google Services installed? Did Aurora store replace Google Services somehow? Many apps depend on those services.
- Mordisquitos 3y ago
  Many of the Google Services functionalities can be provided, mimicked, or worked around with microG: https://microg.org/ https://microg.org/
Andrew_nenakhov 3y ago
Google Play is not just app store, but also the only way to efficiently deliver push notifications on Android devices. And latest modifications to Android OS make it very rippled without push notifications, all background apps unload from memory very fast. The result is that it makes many types of apps impossible to implement without relying on push notifications - and lock in to Google Play services. Same is true for Apple, of course.
- codethief 3y ago
  While they carry almost the same name, Google Play Services are not the same as the Play Store, though. You can use the former without using the latter.
  - Andrew_nenakhov 3y ago
    I highly doubt that a manufacturer can release an Android phone that does not have Google Play Store app but does use Google Play Services. We have evidence that Google prohibits even releasing other models w/out Google Play store if it wants to make Androids with Google Play.
    - codethief 3y ago
      Oh absolutely!

xethos 3y ago

By that measure, F-Droid is very close in that both have the majority of apps some people use (Aurora for you, F-Droid for me). Neither can compete with the Play store though, as only Google's offering is allowed to update or install apps in the background without user interaction (without root). For that matter, only Google Play Protect (part of the Play Store IIRC) can uninstall apps from user's devices with no interaction.

johnnyanmac 3y ago
>only Google Play Protect (part of the Play Store IIRC) can uninstall apps from user's devices with no interaction. That sounds horrible. Why can a store decide to delete an app with no prior notice? But it does seem Google has given more freedom to other apps to install apps. I guess it comes down to if that's still too many clicks or too fear mongering to count as "competitive".
- Psychotherapist 3y ago
  In my experience Google Play Protect can be disabled, and shows a warning an app might be "Harmful" and sometimes prompts to Uninstall or Ignore the warning, afaik no unprompted uninstalls
- ayewo 3y ago
  It’s a security feature. They’ve had this feature for more than a decade [1]. It allows them to remotely remove any malicious app from Android devices without any user intervention. 1: https://www.computerworld.com/article/2752902/google-remotely-removes-android-apps.amp.html https://www.computerworld.com/article/2752902/google-remotel...
  - mminer237 3y ago
    Worse than that, I've had it unilaterally block legitimate third-party apps I've installed from F-Droid. Then since I've disabled it, it constantly nags me to re-enable it so it can re-delete my third-party apps. If you want to talk about anti-competitive, Play "Protect" should be where you start.
noisem4ker 3y ago
> only Google's offering is allowed to update or install apps in the background Not anymore, since Android 12 (2021). https://www.xda-developers.com/android-12-alternative-app-stores-update-apps-background/ https://www.xda-developers.com/android-12-alternative-app-st...
- xethos 3y ago
  You're right! I thought I'd heard something about that, but couldn't quite remember :) From your linked article though: > in response to mounting pressure from Epic Games and government regulators Just because it came out before the judgement doesn't mean it wasn't because of the court case. And frankly, needing to be sued to do the not-a-monopoly thing isn't exactly a great look. Maybe I'm just grouchy because I'll never get to use it though - BlackBerry stopped making handsets, so I'm using either the last great physical keyboard (subjective, but true IMO) while being "stuck" on Android 8.1, or GNU+Linux à la Pinephone Pro.

harrygeez 3y ago

I don't fully understand. Are these functionalities baked into Android that only allow Play Store to use it?

bogwog 3y ago
Pretty much. Google Play services runs as like a root process that can (among other things) bypass all the security checks that the OS usually has. That includes those annoying update confirmation dialogs which make it impossible to install updates automatically without user interaction.
- LoganDark 3y ago
  Specifically GMS runs as a "privileged app" (that's what priv-apps stands for) which can declare access to permissions in the manifest that non-privileged apps can't even ask for.
  - UncleMeat 3y ago
    Importantly, this is largely a property of preloaded apps rather than GMS explicitly.
    - LoganDark 3y ago
      Yeah, they are curated by the author(s) of the Android build that the device is running.
- jacooper 3y ago
  > That includes those annoying update confirmation dialogs which make it impossible to install updates automatically without user interaction. Important to note this has changed starting with android 12, now you just need accept installing the app, and the source can update the app without interaction. Droidify (third party fdroid client) supports it, among others like Aurora store.
- jacooper 3y ago

dredmorbius 3y ago

AFAIU Aurora isn't an alternate store, but an alternate front-end to the Google Play Store. That is, the only apps available through Aurora are those on Google Play, and if Google's rejected an app, then you won't be able to install it via Aurora. By contrast, F-Droid is an alternative front-end and app store, with apps available which aren't included in Google Play (for example, Termux). (I use both Aurora and F-Droid on an Onyx Android device.)

DeathArrow 3y ago

You can install and run apps from Aurora store without having Google Services installed? Did Aurora store replace Google Services somehow? Many apps depend on those services.

Mordisquitos 3y ago
Many of the Google Services functionalities can be provided, mimicked, or worked around with microG: https://microg.org/ https://microg.org/

Andrew_nenakhov 3y ago

Google Play is not just app store, but also the only way to efficiently deliver push notifications on Android devices. And latest modifications to Android OS make it very rippled without push notifications, all background apps unload from memory very fast. The result is that it makes many types of apps impossible to implement without relying on push notifications - and lock in to Google Play services. Same is true for Apple, of course.

codethief 3y ago
While they carry almost the same name, Google Play Services are not the same as the Play Store, though. You can use the former without using the latter.
- Andrew_nenakhov 3y ago
  I highly doubt that a manufacturer can release an Android phone that does not have Google Play Store app but does use Google Play Services. We have evidence that Google prohibits even releasing other models w/out Google Play store if it wants to make Androids with Google Play.
  - codethief 3y ago
    Oh absolutely!