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Although there is no way around the struggle, there is a way around how the struggle is perceived and experienced. A good teacher shows the struggle is worth it

Although there is no way around the struggle, there is a way around how the struggle is perceived and experienced. A good teacher shows the struggle is worth it, but I believe a great teacher makes the struggle something you enjoy doing, and not something you have to put up with so you can enjoy the compensation at some point in the future.

justinclift 3y ago
> I believe a great teacher makes the struggle something you enjoy doing What's a good example of this? :)
- placebo 3y ago
  I think there are two main factors in doing this: The first is creating the passion for the subject matter by making it both fascinating and accessible and by that generating even more curiosity and motivation that I believe are innate in everyone. The second is never letting anyone feel that they are treading water (although this can be seen as a by-product of making things accessible). Even when babies learn how to walk (assuming a healthy and secure environment) they do not need (or would understand) any assurance that the struggle will be worth it. They go for the struggle because the instinct/motivation to explore is already there - it gives a sense of autonomy, of being in control, of making progress, of being involved, of being alive. But no need to make assumptions about what motivates babies - you can look at how people feel when playing games, solving puzzles etc. They don't see it as a struggle, it is something that is a joy to participate in, even though it might be very challenging. A great teacher is someone that makes learning a by-product of having fun. I believe this is possible for any subject, no matter how "difficult" or "boring".
  - justinclift 3y ago
    > A great teacher is someone that makes learning a by-product of having fun. No disagreement with any of what you're saying. But do you have any real life (adult) examples rather than just the equivalent of platitudes? :)
    - placebo 3y ago
      I see nothing wrong with platitudes if they are true :) I'm not sure what examples you're looking for or would find convincing. I can speak about my own experiences of learning new things, where the speed of what I learned were always proportional the how interesting and accessible the material was made to be. In the cases where it was made enjoyable, I usually had more than enough motivation and curiosity to dig deeper using new materials that were less fun to learn (but could have been made fun too). I can also speak of my experiences teaching young people with no knowledge about programming who had preconceptions about how boring and difficult it is, which illustrated the degree of how you teach something has an effect on the perception of struggling. I assume you have your own examples as well, but if you can offer a counterexample I'll reconsider my opinion :) There is another important thing I'd like to point out though. What makes something fun or accessible for one person is not always what will do it for another. Having to teach groups, and especially large groups of people will make it very challenging if not impossible to be the ideal teacher. I'm not judging anyone for not being to be an ideal teacher under these constraints. Just pointing out that this should be the objective - not saying it is always possible.
- hackermailman 3y ago
  Flipped classroom style maybe. Lectures are prerecorded then you as a group struggle with the problem sets in class. A few schools have entire courses for learning the struggle like MITs freshman problem solving course for figuring out Puerto Rico's power grid problems you are given some small area to research yourself and bring that to your student meetings and struggle to a solution. https://terrascope.mit.edu/nextyear/ https://terrascope.mit.edu/nextyear/
  - justinclift 3y ago
    Thanks, that looks like a good approach. :)
    - placebo 3y ago
      Agree, seems like a good example. I also understand what you meant by an example :) Sorry for the misunderstanding...
      - justinclift 3y ago
        No worries at all. :)

justinclift 3y ago

> I believe a great teacher makes the struggle something you enjoy doing What's a good example of this? :)

placebo 3y ago
I think there are two main factors in doing this: The first is creating the passion for the subject matter by making it both fascinating and accessible and by that generating even more curiosity and motivation that I believe are innate in everyone. The second is never letting anyone feel that they are treading water (although this can be seen as a by-product of making things accessible). Even when babies learn how to walk (assuming a healthy and secure environment) they do not need (or would understand) any assurance that the struggle will be worth it. They go for the struggle because the instinct/motivation to explore is already there - it gives a sense of autonomy, of being in control, of making progress, of being involved, of being alive. But no need to make assumptions about what motivates babies - you can look at how people feel when playing games, solving puzzles etc. They don't see it as a struggle, it is something that is a joy to participate in, even though it might be very challenging. A great teacher is someone that makes learning a by-product of having fun. I believe this is possible for any subject, no matter how "difficult" or "boring".
- justinclift 3y ago
  > A great teacher is someone that makes learning a by-product of having fun. No disagreement with any of what you're saying. But do you have any real life (adult) examples rather than just the equivalent of platitudes? :)
  - placebo 3y ago
    I see nothing wrong with platitudes if they are true :) I'm not sure what examples you're looking for or would find convincing. I can speak about my own experiences of learning new things, where the speed of what I learned were always proportional the how interesting and accessible the material was made to be. In the cases where it was made enjoyable, I usually had more than enough motivation and curiosity to dig deeper using new materials that were less fun to learn (but could have been made fun too). I can also speak of my experiences teaching young people with no knowledge about programming who had preconceptions about how boring and difficult it is, which illustrated the degree of how you teach something has an effect on the perception of struggling. I assume you have your own examples as well, but if you can offer a counterexample I'll reconsider my opinion :) There is another important thing I'd like to point out though. What makes something fun or accessible for one person is not always what will do it for another. Having to teach groups, and especially large groups of people will make it very challenging if not impossible to be the ideal teacher. I'm not judging anyone for not being to be an ideal teacher under these constraints. Just pointing out that this should be the objective - not saying it is always possible.
hackermailman 3y ago
Flipped classroom style maybe. Lectures are prerecorded then you as a group struggle with the problem sets in class. A few schools have entire courses for learning the struggle like MITs freshman problem solving course for figuring out Puerto Rico's power grid problems you are given some small area to research yourself and bring that to your student meetings and struggle to a solution. https://terrascope.mit.edu/nextyear/ https://terrascope.mit.edu/nextyear/
- justinclift 3y ago
  Thanks, that looks like a good approach. :)
  - placebo 3y ago
    Agree, seems like a good example. I also understand what you meant by an example :) Sorry for the misunderstanding...
    - justinclift 3y ago
      No worries at all. :)