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Paul Graham's Twitter account targeted by IDF
- esalman 3y ago[flagged]
- ceejayoz 3y agoCare to elaborate? No one's right to speech has been affected here; not pg's nor the IDF's. Free speech has never been the right to not be trolled.
- Tyrek 3y agoFree speech may not be the relevant criticism here, but there's... somewhat of a discomfort of a government (if admittedly foreign) agency calling out specific individuals. I know we're in the era of terminally online politicians, but this crosses some sort of professionalism boundary? EDIT: Which is to say, it's not illegal or anything, but I'm sending a frowning emoji.
- wsgeorge 3y ago> but this crosses some sort of professionalism boundary? I don't know. I assume any organisation interested in directing online discourse about subjects it is vested in does something like this. Especially political organisations. This is politics. Kinda dirty, but that's what it is, I guess. It's probably only noteworthy because the context and persons/groups involved are noteworthy.
- jakelazaroff 3y agoPaul Graham's hasn't, you mean. The IDF is not a person; it has no rights.
- ceejayoz 3y agoThat's not universally true. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commercial_speech https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commercial_speech > In the United States, commercial speech is "entitled to substantial First Amendment protection, albeit less than political, ideological, or artistic speech". Now, the IDF isn't under US jurisdiction, but the idea that only individual humans have rights is... not supported by the facts.
- esalman 3y agoWhat's happening here is plain for everyone to see. IDF has much much more resources, power and influence to suppress the free speech of individuals. You are using IDF's right to free speech as a way to justify the suppression.
- ceejayoz 3y agoAgain, free speech has never been the right to not be trolled, or criticized, or made fun of, or debunked. Swap out the IDF for JK Rowling or Bill Gates sending their followers at someone; there's never been a requirement for equal power between the two speakers for the right to exist. (It's not like pg doesn't have his own resources and connections, anyways.) A "the IDF cannot troll people on Twitter" law would seem to limit free speech, not enhance it.
- esalman 3y agoYou are coming up with some really spectacular arguments. We don't have to go as far as JK Rowling or Bill Gates. There's a billionaire Harvard alumni on Twitter using his "free speech" to harass and doxx Harvard grad students right now. PG cannot detain people or bomb settlements. IDF can and does. They are not merely trolling here.
- esalman 3y agoIDF is not a person. Does 2FA apply to states and corporations? I see this more as manipulation and misinformation rather than free speech.
- sertbdfgbnfgsd 3y agoLol why was this flagged?!
- Powdering7082 3y ago[flagged]
- ASinclair 3y ago"targeted" sounds like they were trying to compromise his account. Instead they were just trying to "ridicule" him.
- 1970-01-01 3y agoAlso, this headline has almost nothing to do with his Twitter account. Twitter was simply the medium for message.
- sertbdfgbnfgsd 3y agoNo, that's not what "targeted" means, you're just making that up. In this context, targeted means he was attacked because he was in some list/satisfied some criterion.
- TMWNN 3y agoWhen I saw the headline I interpreted "targeted by IDF" as some attempt to compromise his account.
- red-iron-pine 3y agoIf you can't crack their SSH key, you DDoS the site or their provider If you can't compromise his account you create a shit-storm or spew fake info to discredit
- m_a_g 3y agoA great write-up related to that: https://jackpoulson.substack.com/p/inside-the-pro-israel-information https://jackpoulson.substack.com/p/inside-the-pro-israel-inf...
- lapcat 3y agoDiscussion https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38572675 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38572675 and https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38567507 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38567507
- sillysaurusx 3y agoThat is a great writeup. Shame https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38572675 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38572675 wasn’t given some front page time. It seems squarely in the "new phenomenon" territory of the guidelines, since tech investors coordinating to fire employees is historically unique.
- oezi 3y agoI don't understand how stringing along assertion after assertion makes a great write-up. This is the substack version of gossip.
- gafage 3y ago[flagged]
- s5300 3y ago[dead]
- recursivedoubts 3y agoblowback, the social media strategy
- vasco 3y agoWait, isn't "well well well" a dog whistle these days that edgelord people use online? Am I spending too much time on TikTok? https://www.hitc.com/en-gb/2023/08/21/well-well-well-meaning-on-tiktok-criticised-amid-rise-of-antisemitic-trend/ https://www.hitc.com/en-gb/2023/08/21/well-well-well-meaning...
- blueflow 3y ago"dog whistle" is such a nasty concept. You can accuse anyone of anything you associate their vocabulary with. The only limit is your imagination and the accused can't really falsify it.
- TMWNN 3y agoAgreed. As someone else said: >The term dog whistle is regularly used as a covert form of Ad Hominem that I find logically annoying, basically "ignore everything this person said because" insert assumption of what was meant and derogatory term about political affiliation. I view the phrase as "I can't find something to attack in what ideological opponent said, so I'm going to pretend that what he said actually means something else, and attack that instead".
- ceejayoz 3y agoThere’s varying degrees here. “Well well well” seems like an extreme stretch, like what you’re describing. If you say “the globalist vermin who secretly control Hollywood and the media” or “urban thugs and welfare queens”, we know what that actually means. There are genuine dog whistles out there.
- ceejayoz 3y agoYes, you are. That article spends a lot of words avoiding any explanation of what "well, well, well" is supposedly saying.
- h2odragon 3y agoIs this worse than having people working for the State Department tell Twitter than your posts shouldn't be seen and cannot be "liked"?
- iAMkenough 3y agoOnly if you paid money to have your posts seen and liked, and then Twitter restricts your posts anyways.
- SuperNinKenDo 3y agoI'm not sure the two can be properly compared. I was going to say it's the same, then I thought maybe it was a little less concerning, but now I'm really not sure. I share your concerns, but maybe we should concentrate on this particular issue when it comes to this particular comment section, because simply bringing this up isn't really adding to the conversation.
- toyg 3y agoIt's the same type of evil, and trying to rank them won't do any good. State actors should get the fuck off our web. Unfortunately, they are unlikely to.
- fundad 3y agoWe don’t yet know the extent of US State Department involvement.
- smlacy 3y agohttps://nitter.net/paulg/status/1733146138226614465 https://nitter.net/paulg/status/1733146138226614465
- 1970-01-01 3y agoSo why this is flagged? Paul is a critical founder for many companies. Knowing that someone is trashing his rep is very important to many others here.
- infecto 3y ago[flagged]
- orionsbelt 3y agoPaul is trashing his rep all on his own. I am Jewish, appalled by Paul’s tweets, but lazy and don’t do anything about it. I fail to see how other Jewish people, that are similarly appalled, but more activist in nature about trying to work together to push back on rising antisemitism, is anything nefarious.
- aaomidi 3y agoAll he’s done is point out that Gaza civilians are being decimated and you’re appalled by those tweets? Kinda telling on yourself there tbh.
- orionsbelt 3y agoPaul’s tweets have a tone and subtext that speak louder than the literal text. As an imperfect analogy, see “all lives matter” or similarly controversial statements that, taken literally, appear harmless.
- hatsix 3y agoExcept that it should be uncontroversial to say that nobody should kill children. But people have lost jobs for saying that Israel needs to stop killing Palestinian children.
- dang 3y agoPlease don't cross into attacking someone else on HN. This topic is extremely inflammatory, so you can be sure that the other person will feel your comment as many times more aggressive than you intended it. Needless to say this goes equally for both sides of the argument.
- infecto 3y agoDisappointed how quickly this post and the related one got flagged and in the other case was dead. I find it fascinating to read and don’t think either are necessarily deserving that? But if it does violate a rule or something greater, I would love to be educated. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38571758 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38571758
- ceejayoz 3y agoThere's a comments-to-votes ratio that triggers deranking, IIRC. Flamewar prevention.
- m_a_g 3y agoThat's not it; there are many upvotes and not many comments on both of those submissions. Honestly, I'm disappointed at the admins.
- infecto 3y agoDeranking is different than dead though right? The other post was live for maybe a minute. I get the flame war prevention but this feels more like individuals killing ideas they don’t agree with. I don’t have skin in the game. Just curious.
- PartiallyTyped 3y agoyes, one moves the post to 2nd page or worse, the other removes completely unless [dead] filter id disabled, plus even lower in ranks.
- SuperNinKenDo 3y agoThere needs to be a function on this site where people can vote to unflag things, this is just ridiculous.
- anigbrowl 3y agoThere is, if you have enough karma there's a 'vouch' option that becomes available to express support for flagged posts.
- SuperNinKenDo 3y agoAh, I thought that was for dead posts only. That's good to know.
- anigbrowl 3y agoMaybe it is? I vouch for things frequently but that's because I have Showdead turned on and scan the New page regularly for unlucky submissions. I personally think it's a little too easy to flag things on HN, it seems as if the threshold to kill a post was set at a time when there was a much smaller userbase.
- Pxtl 3y agoUgh, I'd been avoiding twitter for obvious reasons lately. I'd forgotten how awful the bluecheck-reply slurry was since they started selling those.
- kundi 3y agoHN is one of the rare places online where the much needed discussions could be facilitated for the welfare of all. In this case, the information control implications might overweight the political narrative and be relevant for the people inclined to the truth.
- red-iron-pine 3y ago> HN is one of the rare places online where the much needed discussions could be facilitated for the welfare of all. Brah. HN is a tech posting newsfeed hosted by a startup incubator. There are some very clear biases here, esp. to making a fuck-ton of money. It is also wayyyyy behind other social media sites for stopping obvious spam and shillbots. ain't no welfare of all goin on here.
- smoyer 3y agoMaybe it's used to be behind Twitter in stopping spam and shillbots but now ...
- talm00d-bad 3y ago[flagged]
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]