4 ms·

The important detail which most people seem to miss is that Tesla's workers aren't behind this. They don't want to unionize, because there's no reason to. The

by Geee 3y ago

The important detail which most people seem to miss is that Tesla's workers aren't behind this. They don't want to unionize, because there's no reason to. The IF Metall union is striking because they just want to get their cut.

capableweb 3y ago
> The important detail which most people seem to miss is that Tesla's workers aren't behind this. They don't want to unionize, because there's no reason to. > The IF Metall union is striking because they just want to get their cut. What sort of people do you think IF Metall is made up of? It's the second largest union in Sweden, the people who are a part of the union are also workers at Tesla and other companies. It's not made up of "career-unionists" if that's what you thought.
- peterfirefly 3y ago
  The point is that it's not Tesla's employees that are behind it. It is people working elsewhere -- or rather, the management of the labour unions that organize those other people.
  - VoxPelli 3y ago
    The Tesla employees are behind it. Maybe not all. Some because they are scared of getting punished by Tesla. Something Tesla has indeed threatened with as far as I’m aware.
  - SwedishExpat 3y ago
    > The point is that it's not Tesla's employees that are behind it. How do you know this though? Union membership is anonymous. You have no reason to tell your employer you're a member. If there's a strike all employees can legally take part to help stop identification of members. Every member of Tesla could be a union member saying they aren't to avoid pushback by Tesla. That's just as likely as none of them being a member.
  - capableweb 3y ago
    > The point is that it's not Tesla's employees that are behind it. Unions don't do solidarity strikes across the entire Nordics without having the support of the people they're trying to help. > It is people working elsewhere -- or rather, the management of the labour unions that organize those other people. The people you call "the management of the labour unions" are workers just like the rest. Again, they are not "career-unionists", they are workers who care about worker rights, just like all the other people at the other unions joining the strike.
- Geee 3y ago
  It's a huge organization and has definitely a lot of people employed as "career-unionists". Who do you think the membership fee goes? The membership fee is typically 1.5% of employee salary. Just with a quick calculation 1.5% of 300,000 members x $50,000 average salary results into $225,000,000. Despite what HN seems to think, these unions are bullies and completely unnecessary middle men.
  - capableweb 3y ago
    The fee goes to organise actions, like that people can strike but still get paid. How much experience do you have with Swedish unions specifically? And with Swedish industry in general? Judging by your comments, your experience seems to come from reading US news, is that close to the truth? For example, the percentage of your salary for membership is not a static one, it varies. And even so, it has a max amount (around 60USD last time I checked). Did you account for that when doing your calculations?
occz 3y ago
This is pure propaganda and can be ignored outright. IF Metall are driving these negotiations on behalf of their members working at Tesla - had they not shown any interest, IF Metall would not have bothered.
- Geee 3y ago
  No, it's not. Only 10% of Tesla employees have joined the strike. [0] [0] https://twitter.com/NicklasNilsso14/status/1725557133435863479 https://twitter.com/NicklasNilsso14/status/17255571334358634...
  - occz 3y ago
    Tesla's employees in Sweden are not represented by a single union. Unions are on a -profession basis in Sweden. Only the employees under IF Metall are called out to a strike. You're literally quoting a letter from Tesla, this has no credibility whatsoever.

by Geee 3y ago

capableweb 3y ago

> The important detail which most people seem to miss is that Tesla's workers aren't behind this. They don't want to unionize, because there's no reason to. > The IF Metall union is striking because they just want to get their cut. What sort of people do you think IF Metall is made up of? It's the second largest union in Sweden, the people who are a part of the union are also workers at Tesla and other companies. It's not made up of "career-unionists" if that's what you thought.

peterfirefly 3y ago
The point is that it's not Tesla's employees that are behind it. It is people working elsewhere -- or rather, the management of the labour unions that organize those other people.
- VoxPelli 3y ago
  The Tesla employees are behind it. Maybe not all. Some because they are scared of getting punished by Tesla. Something Tesla has indeed threatened with as far as I’m aware.
- SwedishExpat 3y ago
  > The point is that it's not Tesla's employees that are behind it. How do you know this though? Union membership is anonymous. You have no reason to tell your employer you're a member. If there's a strike all employees can legally take part to help stop identification of members. Every member of Tesla could be a union member saying they aren't to avoid pushback by Tesla. That's just as likely as none of them being a member.
- capableweb 3y ago
  > The point is that it's not Tesla's employees that are behind it. Unions don't do solidarity strikes across the entire Nordics without having the support of the people they're trying to help. > It is people working elsewhere -- or rather, the management of the labour unions that organize those other people. The people you call "the management of the labour unions" are workers just like the rest. Again, they are not "career-unionists", they are workers who care about worker rights, just like all the other people at the other unions joining the strike.
Geee 3y ago
It's a huge organization and has definitely a lot of people employed as "career-unionists". Who do you think the membership fee goes? The membership fee is typically 1.5% of employee salary. Just with a quick calculation 1.5% of 300,000 members x $50,000 average salary results into $225,000,000. Despite what HN seems to think, these unions are bullies and completely unnecessary middle men.
- capableweb 3y ago
  The fee goes to organise actions, like that people can strike but still get paid. How much experience do you have with Swedish unions specifically? And with Swedish industry in general? Judging by your comments, your experience seems to come from reading US news, is that close to the truth? For example, the percentage of your salary for membership is not a static one, it varies. And even so, it has a max amount (around 60USD last time I checked). Did you account for that when doing your calculations?

occz 3y ago

This is pure propaganda and can be ignored outright. IF Metall are driving these negotiations on behalf of their members working at Tesla - had they not shown any interest, IF Metall would not have bothered.

Geee 3y ago
No, it's not. Only 10% of Tesla employees have joined the strike. [0] [0] https://twitter.com/NicklasNilsso14/status/1725557133435863479 https://twitter.com/NicklasNilsso14/status/17255571334358634...
- occz 3y ago
  Tesla's employees in Sweden are not represented by a single union. Unions are on a -profession basis in Sweden. Only the employees under IF Metall are called out to a strike. You're literally quoting a letter from Tesla, this has no credibility whatsoever.