5 ms·

It is interesting to read the comments. Why do some americans view the strike action in a black/white perspective? If you define a strike very narrowly as to s

by vaidhy 3y ago

It is interesting to read the comments. Why do some americans view the strike action in a black/white perspective? If you define a strike very narrowly as to stop work with (partial) loss of pay, then this does not make sense. But a strike can be against one entity, one action or even one person. The workers can say "I will not do this action" and that is a strike too.

callalex 3y ago
The people here honestly, genuinely believe that they will be the next Musk if they just code hard enough.
- henry2023 3y ago
  When education is not liberating, the dream of the oppressed is to become the oppressor. - Paulo Freire.
lotsofpulp 3y ago
>But a strike can be against one entity, one action or even one person. For the purposes of a business negotiation, a strike means to refuse to sell your labor for under a certain price. Picking and choosing who you refuse to sell your labor to quickly encroaches on tribalism that has historically played out with negative consequences. I imagine the reason this has not gone badly (that I know of, I guess) is Sweden is relatively monocultural. In a society with more tribal boundaries like the US, I feel like this could be a bigger problem. In my opinion, these groups striking would be engaging in business negotations if they chose to completely stop working until their demands were met (which in this case seems to be another group's minimum compensation).
- vaidhy 3y ago
  >For the purposes of a business negotiation, a strike means to refuse to sell your labor for under a certain price. Picking and choosing who you refuse to sell your labor to quickly encroaches on tribalism that has historically played out with negative consequences. When hollywood actors did a strike in support of the writers, it is to enable business negotiations for the writers, not necessarily for the actors. Worker solidarity means that if I support your cause today and I face similar situation tomorrow, you will support me. It sounds to me like collective action to force a business to negotiate. I do not understand the tribalism argument very well. All of us form tribes and our social structure depends on it. Tribes are formed based on membership (either by birth, where you live, your political beliefs, your economic status etc) and you can argue whether that membership is a good thing for society, but I do not believe the argument is whether tribes are good or bad. They just are.
  - lotsofpulp 3y ago
    >I do not understand the tribalism argument very well. The Hollywood actors' union did not stop selling to a specific entity, they stopped work across the board. Also, I think their most recent strike was because their contract ended. Another difference is also negotiating a pure luxury good (entertainment), versus negotiating access to legally required license plates.
    - dragonwriter 3y ago
      > The Hollywood actors' union did not stop selling to a specific entity, they stopped work across the board. Not entirely true; they stopped work for firms with which they did not have a labor agreement in place; they reached interim deals with a number of indie productions allowing work to proceed, even while the negotiations with the AMPTP were taking place.
fzeroracer 3y ago
Speaking as an American, it's because we have a long history of collaborative efforts between capital and government to depress or destroy labor movements. The black/white perspectives on strikes is one such example, particularly because almost all of our jobs start with some anti-labor training [1]. There was also the air traffic controller strike that was deemed illegal by Ronald Reagan [2] and the more recent efforts by companies such as Starbucks outright shuttering stores or harassing employees to stop unionization. Within this framework, there's a lot of people who view strikes as not just wrong but morally wrong. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2j3ZNUxqo9M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2j3ZNUxqo9M (this is an older example, but this is the kind of stuff I saw when I worked for target long ago) [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professional_Air_Traffic_Controllers_Organization_(1968) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professional_Air_Traffic_Contr...

by vaidhy 3y ago

callalex 3y ago

The people here honestly, genuinely believe that they will be the next Musk if they just code hard enough.

henry2023 3y ago
When education is not liberating, the dream of the oppressed is to become the oppressor. - Paulo Freire.

lotsofpulp 3y ago

>But a strike can be against one entity, one action or even one person. For the purposes of a business negotiation, a strike means to refuse to sell your labor for under a certain price. Picking and choosing who you refuse to sell your labor to quickly encroaches on tribalism that has historically played out with negative consequences. I imagine the reason this has not gone badly (that I know of, I guess) is Sweden is relatively monocultural. In a society with more tribal boundaries like the US, I feel like this could be a bigger problem. In my opinion, these groups striking would be engaging in business negotations if they chose to completely stop working until their demands were met (which in this case seems to be another group's minimum compensation).

vaidhy 3y ago
>For the purposes of a business negotiation, a strike means to refuse to sell your labor for under a certain price. Picking and choosing who you refuse to sell your labor to quickly encroaches on tribalism that has historically played out with negative consequences. When hollywood actors did a strike in support of the writers, it is to enable business negotiations for the writers, not necessarily for the actors. Worker solidarity means that if I support your cause today and I face similar situation tomorrow, you will support me. It sounds to me like collective action to force a business to negotiate. I do not understand the tribalism argument very well. All of us form tribes and our social structure depends on it. Tribes are formed based on membership (either by birth, where you live, your political beliefs, your economic status etc) and you can argue whether that membership is a good thing for society, but I do not believe the argument is whether tribes are good or bad. They just are.
- lotsofpulp 3y ago
  >I do not understand the tribalism argument very well. The Hollywood actors' union did not stop selling to a specific entity, they stopped work across the board. Also, I think their most recent strike was because their contract ended. Another difference is also negotiating a pure luxury good (entertainment), versus negotiating access to legally required license plates.
  - dragonwriter 3y ago
    > The Hollywood actors' union did not stop selling to a specific entity, they stopped work across the board. Not entirely true; they stopped work for firms with which they did not have a labor agreement in place; they reached interim deals with a number of indie productions allowing work to proceed, even while the negotiations with the AMPTP were taking place.

fzeroracer 3y ago

Speaking as an American, it's because we have a long history of collaborative efforts between capital and government to depress or destroy labor movements. The black/white perspectives on strikes is one such example, particularly because almost all of our jobs start with some anti-labor training [1]. There was also the air traffic controller strike that was deemed illegal by Ronald Reagan [2] and the more recent efforts by companies such as Starbucks outright shuttering stores or harassing employees to stop unionization. Within this framework, there's a lot of people who view strikes as not just wrong but morally wrong. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2j3ZNUxqo9M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2j3ZNUxqo9M (this is an older example, but this is the kind of stuff I saw when I worked for target long ago) [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professional_Air_Traffic_Controllers_Organization_(1968) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Professional_Air_Traffic_Contr...