4 ms·

> Internet piracy isn’t ethically justifiable, but it is convenient. Intellectual property isn't ethically justifiable, but it is convenient for some. > Illeg

> Internet piracy isn’t ethically justifiable, but it is convenient. Intellectual property isn't ethically justifiable, but it is convenient for some. > Illegal downloading of copyrighted materials takes up 24% of the global bandwidth. In many (most?) jurisdictions downloading material is not illegal. Have these been subtracted from this figure, or is this yet another lie? Given the history of this propaganda, I'm quite sure it's the latter.

still-old 3y ago
How ethical is it to not report how much you(dataprot) got paid for this schilling?
voisin 3y ago
> Illegal downloading of copyrighted materials takes up 24% of the global bandwidth. This seems shockingly high. I wonder how different this is geographically. I would think streaming via Netflix and others, YouTube, Twitch, etc would have shrunk illegal streaming to a much smaller percentage of the total.
- ghaff 3y ago
  I'm sure it varies a lot geographically. In the US, I expect the bulk is streaming services as you say. While I'm sure there are many outliers on a forum like this, most people subscribe to a few services and watch what's available. I know I do. I'll rarely look for something elsewhere if I can't easily get it via streaming (whether subscription or a la carte). I have no particular insight into the global situation but certainly availability is patchier and incomes are often lower.
  - voisin 3y ago
    So let’s say it varies geographically and the majority is in developing nations where finances don’t allow for relative luxuries like streaming services so people disproportionately turn to torrents. I suspect this is accurate. In this instance, what’s the point of trying to lock down illegal streaming? There isn’t an opportunity cost being missed, and the people can’t afford to pay fines, so it seems like a no win situation. Let them be and maybe as those countries develop and people become wealthier they follow the same path as developed nations where most people pay for the ease of streaming.
- jampekka 3y ago
  Seems incredibly high. Literally incredibly.
justaman 3y ago
> Illegal downloading of copyrighted materials takes up 24% of the global bandwidth. Completely impossible. Think of how much bandwidth is used for HD streaming of twitch, netflix, ABC-XYZ +, and social media. Piracy making up even 5% of global bandwidth usage is being overly generous.
- jerf 3y ago
  Might be able to get to 24% if "illegal downloading of copyrighted material" includes porn.
  - TeMPOraL 3y ago
    It'd probably stay the same if you excluded everything other than porn from your calculations.
  - tomashubelbauer 3y ago
    But in many jurisdictions that would still be completely legal as long as you didn't share the downloaded content with others.
  - e2le 3y ago
    Porn was excluded from the study. "What we're looking at is any type of infringing content. Film content, television, books, software, games, music. The only thing we're not looking at is pornography." https://web.archive.org/web/20131005143240/http://www.netnames.com/sizing_the_piracy_universe https://web.archive.org/web/20131005143240/http://www.netnam...
- Moldoteck 3y ago
  are you sure downloading of cop material is illegal? In a lot of countries it is permitted as long as you do not distribute that content further
  - HideousKojima 3y ago
    And even in the US merely downloading is usually only a civil and not a criminal offense
e2le 3y ago
The lack of links to sources in that article is disturbing. Requiring users find each of their sources is evil, and I suspect intentional. I believe this might be their source: https://www.creativefuture.org/new-study-the-size-and-scope-of-global-internet-piracy-is-on-the-rise-video/ https://www.creativefuture.org/new-study-the-size-and-scope-... Which links to a Los Angeles Times article [1] from 2013, but not the study. The Los Angeles Times article also lacks a link to the study quoted. According to Creative Future, the study came from NetNames [2]. I did find some other interesting [3] articles [4] published on the Creative Future site. [1]: https://www.latimes.com/entertainment/envelope/cotown/la-fi-ct-piracy-bandwith-20130917-story.html https://www.latimes.com/entertainment/envelope/cotown/la-fi-... [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NetNames https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NetNames [3]: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=site%3Acreativefuture.org%2F+bandwidth https://duckduckgo.com/?q=site%3Acreativefuture.org%2F+bandw... [4]: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=site%3Acreativefuture.org%2F+piracy https://duckduckgo.com/?q=site%3Acreativefuture.org%2F+pirac... The NetNames site is no longer active however it was archived [5], the full report is missing. This is infuriating. If the study cannot be read, it might as well not exist. I found a Torrent Freak article from 2013 [6] with more details. [5]: https://web.archive.org/web/20131005143240/http://www.netnames.com/sizing_the_piracy_universe https://web.archive.org/web/20131005143240/http://www.netnam... [6]: https://torrentfreak.com/432-million-pirates-share-9567-petabytes-a-month-130917/ https://torrentfreak.com/432-million-pirates-share-9567-peta...
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
mynegation 3y ago
Probably better wording is “downloading of illegally obtained content”? Even if in a specific jurisdiction it is not illegal - someone in a jurisdiction where it is illegal bought or rented and _ripped_ that DVD (figuratively speaking).

still-old 3y ago

How ethical is it to not report how much you(dataprot) got paid for this schilling?

voisin 3y ago

> Illegal downloading of copyrighted materials takes up 24% of the global bandwidth. This seems shockingly high. I wonder how different this is geographically. I would think streaming via Netflix and others, YouTube, Twitch, etc would have shrunk illegal streaming to a much smaller percentage of the total.

ghaff 3y ago
I'm sure it varies a lot geographically. In the US, I expect the bulk is streaming services as you say. While I'm sure there are many outliers on a forum like this, most people subscribe to a few services and watch what's available. I know I do. I'll rarely look for something elsewhere if I can't easily get it via streaming (whether subscription or a la carte). I have no particular insight into the global situation but certainly availability is patchier and incomes are often lower.
- voisin 3y ago
  So let’s say it varies geographically and the majority is in developing nations where finances don’t allow for relative luxuries like streaming services so people disproportionately turn to torrents. I suspect this is accurate. In this instance, what’s the point of trying to lock down illegal streaming? There isn’t an opportunity cost being missed, and the people can’t afford to pay fines, so it seems like a no win situation. Let them be and maybe as those countries develop and people become wealthier they follow the same path as developed nations where most people pay for the ease of streaming.
jampekka 3y ago
Seems incredibly high. Literally incredibly.

justaman 3y ago

> Illegal downloading of copyrighted materials takes up 24% of the global bandwidth. Completely impossible. Think of how much bandwidth is used for HD streaming of twitch, netflix, ABC-XYZ +, and social media. Piracy making up even 5% of global bandwidth usage is being overly generous.

jerf 3y ago
Might be able to get to 24% if "illegal downloading of copyrighted material" includes porn.
- TeMPOraL 3y ago
  It'd probably stay the same if you excluded everything other than porn from your calculations.
- tomashubelbauer 3y ago
  But in many jurisdictions that would still be completely legal as long as you didn't share the downloaded content with others.
- e2le 3y ago
  Porn was excluded from the study. "What we're looking at is any type of infringing content. Film content, television, books, software, games, music. The only thing we're not looking at is pornography." https://web.archive.org/web/20131005143240/http://www.netnames.com/sizing_the_piracy_universe https://web.archive.org/web/20131005143240/http://www.netnam...
Moldoteck 3y ago
are you sure downloading of cop material is illegal? In a lot of countries it is permitted as long as you do not distribute that content further
- HideousKojima 3y ago
  And even in the US merely downloading is usually only a civil and not a criminal offense

e2le 3y ago

The lack of links to sources in that article is disturbing. Requiring users find each of their sources is evil, and I suspect intentional. I believe this might be their source: https://www.creativefuture.org/new-study-the-size-and-scope-of-global-internet-piracy-is-on-the-rise-video/ https://www.creativefuture.org/new-study-the-size-and-scope-... Which links to a Los Angeles Times article [1] from 2013, but not the study. The Los Angeles Times article also lacks a link to the study quoted. According to Creative Future, the study came from NetNames [2]. I did find some other interesting [3] articles [4] published on the Creative Future site. [1]: https://www.latimes.com/entertainment/envelope/cotown/la-fi-ct-piracy-bandwith-20130917-story.html https://www.latimes.com/entertainment/envelope/cotown/la-fi-... [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NetNames https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NetNames [3]: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=site%3Acreativefuture.org%2F+bandwidth https://duckduckgo.com/?q=site%3Acreativefuture.org%2F+bandw... [4]: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=site%3Acreativefuture.org%2F+piracy https://duckduckgo.com/?q=site%3Acreativefuture.org%2F+pirac... The NetNames site is no longer active however it was archived [5], the full report is missing. This is infuriating. If the study cannot be read, it might as well not exist. I found a Torrent Freak article from 2013 [6] with more details. [5]: https://web.archive.org/web/20131005143240/http://www.netnames.com/sizing_the_piracy_universe https://web.archive.org/web/20131005143240/http://www.netnam... [6]: https://torrentfreak.com/432-million-pirates-share-9567-petabytes-a-month-130917/ https://torrentfreak.com/432-million-pirates-share-9567-peta...

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

mynegation 3y ago

Probably better wording is “downloading of illegally obtained content”? Even if in a specific jurisdiction it is not illegal - someone in a jurisdiction where it is illegal bought or rented and _ripped_ that DVD (figuratively speaking).