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What do you expect this would look like? That's a billion dollar project if you consider the scale of the people involved in making it happen. And it would li

by treyd 3y ago

What do you expect this would look like? That's a billion dollar project if you consider the scale of the people involved in making it happen. And it would likely be better of spent on improving Linux desktop UX, which many nontechnical people already don't have serious objections to.

Workaccount2 3y ago
The core problem with linux is that it is built and maintained by people who love linux. It has lead to an OS that is great for grandmas and great for the linux tech nerd grandson who set it up for her. But its an exercise in masochistic self flagellation to be a tech nerd with no interest in linux (learning OS structure and CLI syntax) to use it on a daily basis. Linux is extremely powerful via the command line. But I have no interest in learning/memorizing commands.
- JohnFen 3y ago
  > Linux is extremely powerful via the command line. But I have no interest in learning/memorizing commands. It's entirely possible to install and use Linux without touching the command line, just like with Windows. The days where command-line skills were required passed a long while back.
  - Workaccount2 3y ago
    Hence why I added the line "great for grandmas".
- treyd 3y ago
  > But I have no interest in learning/memorizing commands. Of course they're UX issues that could be improved, especially with Canonical trying to push Snap on people, but I'm more inclined to believe many peoples' exasperation with the Linux desktop experience is really due to long-standing familiarity with Windows. The things you "have to learn" as an enthusiast coming from the Windows ecosystem are things that by its conventions are done through graphical interfaces. Which doesn't make them easier, you've just already memorized them.
  - Workaccount2 3y ago
    Yes, correct, exactly. So I need someone to make an OS with the longstanding windows user in mind. Using a GUI absolutely is easier. I need drop down lists and check boxes. Mouse hover tips and visual menus. Not some cryptographic string of command line arguments that I am futilely copy+pasting from some random web page.
    - treyd 3y ago
      It's easier to you because you're already familiar with it. But as someone that hasn't regularly used Windows in many years, I find performing administrative tasks and any kind of troubleshooting via Windows's opaque graphical interfaces to be a very manual and nail-pulling experience. Additionally, graphical interfaces have a lot of downsides, as Microsoft themselves has discovered as evidenced by how over the past couple years they've been promoting PowerShell as a way to automate administrative tasks on Windows themselves and allow powerusers to pass around PowerShell invocations for quick fixes in the same way users of every other OS have for decades.
- conor- 3y ago
  Linux is closer to being a generally accessible OS than ever before, especially with Valve pushing it as a 1st class platform for gaming. A desktop environment like KDE is a fully modern, integrated desktop even down to being able to use KDE Connect to use your smart phone from your desktop. You mentioned hating Ubuntu and 3 other distros, but really the fundamental differences between distros is mostly how they package software, and how frequently they downstream new software. Install something like Pop_OS, never touch a terminal and move on.
- rstuart4133 3y ago
  > But its an exercise in masochistic self flagellation to be a tech nerd with no interest in linux (learning OS structure and CLI syntax) Somewhat true. But ... it's also true for Windows. Did you see the post above? https://github.com/GoofGarage/Win11Clean https://github.com/GoofGarage/Win11Clean. It's a very long list of instructions just to get the think installed in a way that keeps most of Microsoft's fingers out of your pockets and while keeping the familiar Windows interface. But if you follow it you will have a non-standard install, and later some overnight upgrade will break it.

by treyd 3y ago

Workaccount2 3y ago

The core problem with linux is that it is built and maintained by people who love linux. It has lead to an OS that is great for grandmas and great for the linux tech nerd grandson who set it up for her. But its an exercise in masochistic self flagellation to be a tech nerd with no interest in linux (learning OS structure and CLI syntax) to use it on a daily basis. Linux is extremely powerful via the command line. But I have no interest in learning/memorizing commands.

JohnFen 3y ago
> Linux is extremely powerful via the command line. But I have no interest in learning/memorizing commands. It's entirely possible to install and use Linux without touching the command line, just like with Windows. The days where command-line skills were required passed a long while back.
- Workaccount2 3y ago
  Hence why I added the line "great for grandmas".
treyd 3y ago
> But I have no interest in learning/memorizing commands. Of course they're UX issues that could be improved, especially with Canonical trying to push Snap on people, but I'm more inclined to believe many peoples' exasperation with the Linux desktop experience is really due to long-standing familiarity with Windows. The things you "have to learn" as an enthusiast coming from the Windows ecosystem are things that by its conventions are done through graphical interfaces. Which doesn't make them easier, you've just already memorized them.
- Workaccount2 3y ago
  Yes, correct, exactly. So I need someone to make an OS with the longstanding windows user in mind. Using a GUI absolutely is easier. I need drop down lists and check boxes. Mouse hover tips and visual menus. Not some cryptographic string of command line arguments that I am futilely copy+pasting from some random web page.
  - treyd 3y ago
    It's easier to you because you're already familiar with it. But as someone that hasn't regularly used Windows in many years, I find performing administrative tasks and any kind of troubleshooting via Windows's opaque graphical interfaces to be a very manual and nail-pulling experience. Additionally, graphical interfaces have a lot of downsides, as Microsoft themselves has discovered as evidenced by how over the past couple years they've been promoting PowerShell as a way to automate administrative tasks on Windows themselves and allow powerusers to pass around PowerShell invocations for quick fixes in the same way users of every other OS have for decades.
conor- 3y ago
Linux is closer to being a generally accessible OS than ever before, especially with Valve pushing it as a 1st class platform for gaming. A desktop environment like KDE is a fully modern, integrated desktop even down to being able to use KDE Connect to use your smart phone from your desktop. You mentioned hating Ubuntu and 3 other distros, but really the fundamental differences between distros is mostly how they package software, and how frequently they downstream new software. Install something like Pop_OS, never touch a terminal and move on.
rstuart4133 3y ago
> But its an exercise in masochistic self flagellation to be a tech nerd with no interest in linux (learning OS structure and CLI syntax) Somewhat true. But ... it's also true for Windows. Did you see the post above? https://github.com/GoofGarage/Win11Clean https://github.com/GoofGarage/Win11Clean. It's a very long list of instructions just to get the think installed in a way that keeps most of Microsoft's fingers out of your pockets and while keeping the familiar Windows interface. But if you follow it you will have a non-standard install, and later some overnight upgrade will break it.