3 ms·

There's all the rest of open source, and then there's SQLite. A public domain software that doesn't accept contributions from outsiders, and that happens to run

by p-e-w 3y ago

There's all the rest of open source, and then there's SQLite. A public domain software that doesn't accept contributions from outsiders, and that happens to run much of the world. And it just keeps getting better and better and better, and faster and faster and faster. I don't know how these guys manage to succeed where almost all other projects fail, but I hope they keep going.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
whalesalad 3y ago
Sometimes you gotta keep the riff raff out in order to march forwards with your vision. Too many cooks in the kitchen can be deadly.
kccqzy 3y ago
It's perhaps the best example of the cathedral model of open source.
- zertrin 3y ago
  Yeah, learned about it while reading the documentation of Fossil (from the same SQLite people). Their approach certainly has its own merits (and drawbacks). Just wondering how they will transition once the original few people at the top of the hierarchy need to retire, eventually it will happen. I guess they need to find younger trusted committers with the same dedication and spirit. That's not necessarily easy. But for a piece of software as important as SQLite, I have a feeling they will find those.
  - ykonstant 3y ago
    >Just wondering how they will transition once the original few people at the top of the hierarchy need to retire, eventually it will happen. I had always viewed this as a "future worry", and then Bram Moolenaar passed away :(
    - dspillett 3y ago
      The problem with “future worry”s is that the Universe doesn't always agree with us on when that future will be, and it often happens to be closer than expected, even more often closer than desired.
LVB 3y ago
The patterns I've noticed, watching it evolve for nearly 20 years are: - They draft behind others, and I mean this in a good way. They seem to eschew trailblazing new features, but keep a close eye on alternatives (esp. Postgres) and how use cases are emerging. When a sufficiently interesting concept has stabilized, they bring it to SQLite. - Closely related to this, they seem to stay clear of technical and community distractions. They have their plans and execute. - I don't know if D. Richard Hipp is considered a BDFL, but that's my impression and he seems good at it.
- vsnf 3y ago
  When put this way, it reminds me how Apple generally chooses to add features to the iPhone. They wait for use cases to be proven, usually by Samsung, and then add a very polished version to the phone.
  - jiehong 3y ago
    And Java is similar nowadays
  - 6510 3y ago
    Arguably the entire app eco system exists only to farm features. This is arguably the case whenever users are allowed to create things. Go get a pro subscription with each of your competitors :)
ykonstant 3y ago
Can anyone comment on the characteristics of the source code? Is the sqlite source worth reading for someone who is well-versed in C and x86 assembly, and has a rudimentary knowledge of databases?
- eesmith 3y ago
  "If you're looking into building your own database ...SQLite is amazing. It has very clean and readable code, so I'd suggest using it as a reference" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21041833 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21041833 "I suggest SQLite because the source code is superb (seriously, some of the most readable, most logically organized and best commented C code you'll ever see)" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12559301 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12559301 "it never hurts to look at a good open-source codebase written in C, for example the SQLite code is worth looking at (if a bit overwhelming)" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33132772 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33132772
cryptonector 3y ago
> I don't know how these guys manage to succeed where almost all other projects fail, [...]. They have a proprietary (not open source) test suite with 100% branch coverage. That makes it impossible to have credible forks of SQLite3. And it makes the gatekeepers valuable because SQLite3 is the most widely used piece of software ever built. So there's a SQLite Consortium, and all the big tech players that depend on SQLite3 are members, and that's how the SQLite team pays the bills.

by p-e-w 3y ago

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

whalesalad 3y ago

Sometimes you gotta keep the riff raff out in order to march forwards with your vision. Too many cooks in the kitchen can be deadly.

kccqzy 3y ago

It's perhaps the best example of the cathedral model of open source.

zertrin 3y ago
Yeah, learned about it while reading the documentation of Fossil (from the same SQLite people). Their approach certainly has its own merits (and drawbacks). Just wondering how they will transition once the original few people at the top of the hierarchy need to retire, eventually it will happen. I guess they need to find younger trusted committers with the same dedication and spirit. That's not necessarily easy. But for a piece of software as important as SQLite, I have a feeling they will find those.
- ykonstant 3y ago
  >Just wondering how they will transition once the original few people at the top of the hierarchy need to retire, eventually it will happen. I had always viewed this as a "future worry", and then Bram Moolenaar passed away :(
  - dspillett 3y ago
    The problem with “future worry”s is that the Universe doesn't always agree with us on when that future will be, and it often happens to be closer than expected, even more often closer than desired.

LVB 3y ago

The patterns I've noticed, watching it evolve for nearly 20 years are: - They draft behind others, and I mean this in a good way. They seem to eschew trailblazing new features, but keep a close eye on alternatives (esp. Postgres) and how use cases are emerging. When a sufficiently interesting concept has stabilized, they bring it to SQLite. - Closely related to this, they seem to stay clear of technical and community distractions. They have their plans and execute. - I don't know if D. Richard Hipp is considered a BDFL, but that's my impression and he seems good at it.

vsnf 3y ago
When put this way, it reminds me how Apple generally chooses to add features to the iPhone. They wait for use cases to be proven, usually by Samsung, and then add a very polished version to the phone.
- jiehong 3y ago
  And Java is similar nowadays
- 6510 3y ago
  Arguably the entire app eco system exists only to farm features. This is arguably the case whenever users are allowed to create things. Go get a pro subscription with each of your competitors :)

ykonstant 3y ago

Can anyone comment on the characteristics of the source code? Is the sqlite source worth reading for someone who is well-versed in C and x86 assembly, and has a rudimentary knowledge of databases?

eesmith 3y ago
"If you're looking into building your own database ...SQLite is amazing. It has very clean and readable code, so I'd suggest using it as a reference" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21041833 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21041833 "I suggest SQLite because the source code is superb (seriously, some of the most readable, most logically organized and best commented C code you'll ever see)" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12559301 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12559301 "it never hurts to look at a good open-source codebase written in C, for example the SQLite code is worth looking at (if a bit overwhelming)" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33132772 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33132772

cryptonector 3y ago

> I don't know how these guys manage to succeed where almost all other projects fail, [...]. They have a proprietary (not open source) test suite with 100% branch coverage. That makes it impossible to have credible forks of SQLite3. And it makes the gatekeepers valuable because SQLite3 is the most widely used piece of software ever built. So there's a SQLite Consortium, and all the big tech players that depend on SQLite3 are members, and that's how the SQLite team pays the bills.