4 ms·

I am in favour of making you pay for the externalities with taxes. Fair?

GauntletWizard 3y ago
So long as you're willing to pay full price for a loaf of bread after we make that move, and you're willing to understand that no-one owes you said bread, and that you will starve when you're unable to afford it.
- thejohnconway 3y ago
  Obviously, in a quick rejoinder I have not given a complete overview of my opinions on the matter. We obviously need delivery vehicles, electrified where we can. I'm hoping we can find something better than a two-ton box for moving a single person around to arbitrary locations. Small single-person electric vehicles, like an enclosed quad-bike, for example, seem more proportionate. None of this can be done immediately, but it can be phased-in over a sensible amount of time. Shame we didn't start 30 years ago.
  - verdverm 3y ago
    What would you replace all the plastics and polyester with?
    - snoopsnopp 3y ago
      [flagged]
      - verdverm 3y ago
        COVID exists, however it was not "cured" The vaccine improved outcomes but did not immunize you from getting the disease. Plenty of evidence supports this As others have said, you need to adjust your tone and stop making accusations because the HN community does not like what you say. If you don't again, I will reach out to dang so he can take a look and take appropriate action. Has this happened to you recently and the reason you have a fresh account with strong opinions about the bias of HN?
- metabagel 3y ago
  A note from the pro-starvation lobby. Welcome, welcome!
nadermx 3y ago
"externalities" one of my favorite economic terms
EA-3167 3y ago
Are cars and fuel not already heavily taxed?
- thejohnconway 3y ago
  To the level of destruction they cause the environment, health, and the contribution oil has in starting wars? Honestly, I don't know, but I think it's pretty unlikely to be even close to enough. And those taxes need to be spent on direct mitigation, not just on maintaining infrastructure for cars.
gretch 3y ago
Well taxes on cars and fuel are being paid. So what additions are you talking about? Also, it's certainly fair to be in favor of something and to have an opinion. It's a different matter to get a bill written and passed by democratic legislators. When it isn't (because let's be real, America is not restructuring it's entire lifestyle), is that fair?
- lotsofpulp 3y ago
  If you think US suburban living is more detrimental than beneficial, the answer would be whatever level of taxation forces people to give up their suburban and a exurban lifestyles.
  - thfuran 3y ago
    No, that's not what pricing in externalities is. It'd be taxing at whatever level is necessary to pay for the damages caused, not at the level that forces people not to do the damage.
    - lotsofpulp 3y ago
      Nature does not offer the option of “paying for the damages caused”. We cannot fix it or replace it like a fungible good. You either prevent the damage from occurring, or you deal with the consequences. E.g. the damage to communities from being in isolated residences in unwalkable communities where kids cannot freely play outside has no dollar amount.
      - thfuran 3y ago
        >We cannot fix it or replace it like a fungible good. That rather depends on exactly what we're talking about. CO2 can be stripped from the atmosphere, for example. It's just somewhat expensive. >E.g. the damage to communities from being in isolated residences in unwalkable communities where kids cannot freely play outside has no dollar amount. Sure it does. Even deaths have reasonably well established values, legally speaking. And things like expected future medical costs or lost productivity are much more straightforward to assign a value.

So long as you're willing to pay full price for a loaf of bread after we make that move, and you're willing to understand that no-one owes you said bread, and that you will starve when you're unable to afford it.

thejohnconway 3y ago
Obviously, in a quick rejoinder I have not given a complete overview of my opinions on the matter. We obviously need delivery vehicles, electrified where we can. I'm hoping we can find something better than a two-ton box for moving a single person around to arbitrary locations. Small single-person electric vehicles, like an enclosed quad-bike, for example, seem more proportionate. None of this can be done immediately, but it can be phased-in over a sensible amount of time. Shame we didn't start 30 years ago.
- verdverm 3y ago
  What would you replace all the plastics and polyester with?
  - snoopsnopp 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - verdverm 3y ago
      COVID exists, however it was not "cured" The vaccine improved outcomes but did not immunize you from getting the disease. Plenty of evidence supports this As others have said, you need to adjust your tone and stop making accusations because the HN community does not like what you say. If you don't again, I will reach out to dang so he can take a look and take appropriate action. Has this happened to you recently and the reason you have a fresh account with strong opinions about the bias of HN?
metabagel 3y ago
A note from the pro-starvation lobby. Welcome, welcome!

nadermx 3y ago

"externalities" one of my favorite economic terms

EA-3167 3y ago

Are cars and fuel not already heavily taxed?

thejohnconway 3y ago
To the level of destruction they cause the environment, health, and the contribution oil has in starting wars? Honestly, I don't know, but I think it's pretty unlikely to be even close to enough. And those taxes need to be spent on direct mitigation, not just on maintaining infrastructure for cars.

gretch 3y ago

Well taxes on cars and fuel are being paid. So what additions are you talking about? Also, it's certainly fair to be in favor of something and to have an opinion. It's a different matter to get a bill written and passed by democratic legislators. When it isn't (because let's be real, America is not restructuring it's entire lifestyle), is that fair?

lotsofpulp 3y ago
If you think US suburban living is more detrimental than beneficial, the answer would be whatever level of taxation forces people to give up their suburban and a exurban lifestyles.
- thfuran 3y ago
  No, that's not what pricing in externalities is. It'd be taxing at whatever level is necessary to pay for the damages caused, not at the level that forces people not to do the damage.
  - lotsofpulp 3y ago
    Nature does not offer the option of “paying for the damages caused”. We cannot fix it or replace it like a fungible good. You either prevent the damage from occurring, or you deal with the consequences. E.g. the damage to communities from being in isolated residences in unwalkable communities where kids cannot freely play outside has no dollar amount.
    - thfuran 3y ago
      >We cannot fix it or replace it like a fungible good. That rather depends on exactly what we're talking about. CO2 can be stripped from the atmosphere, for example. It's just somewhat expensive. >E.g. the damage to communities from being in isolated residences in unwalkable communities where kids cannot freely play outside has no dollar amount. Sure it does. Even deaths have reasonably well established values, legally speaking. And things like expected future medical costs or lost productivity are much more straightforward to assign a value.