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Google has, in my opinion, a severe problem with change for the sake of change. I use a lot of Google software but it seems like something is always changing wi

Google has, in my opinion, a severe problem with change for the sake of change. I use a lot of Google software but it seems like something is always changing with new versions and not for the better but not always for the worse either, just different. It's fairly frustrating especially in apps I use infrequently. They just don't seem to value a long term and consistent user experience.

cromka 3y ago
I remember reading this is a side effect of their corporate ladder structure, where successful projects for “new stuff” are used to self-advocate for promotion. Not unlike any other corporations, to be fair.
piva00 3y ago
Agreed, I feel it's definitely Conway's law in effect, the org structure is being delivered: PMs need promotions so will change things for the sake of change, to have something to be delivered that is not only maintenance or steady small upgrades. To get a promotion it needs to be flashier, PMs chase "impact" (whatever that means) and not a "this is a nice and consistent user experience". To the detriment of us all, users... Unfortunately I don't have many examples of large orgs being able to escape Conway's law, every larger org I've worked at has this issue. After 2 decades in tech I definitely feel the incentives are all wrong, what organisations push for the ticking box process of getting promotions is quite disconnected from the needs of users. Given enough time, inevitably, it breaks.
- pmontra 3y ago
  How about no incentives, just get the money at the end of the month?
  - piva00 3y ago
    I'd be extremely glad for that, fucking tired of all the political games to keep churning projects a PM wanted for their promotion package, regardless how actually useful it was 2-5 years down the line, usually abandoning the team right after they jump up in their career... I haven't had a PM for longer than a year or so in a long time. Getting pretty exhausted by the endless cycles of: 1. new PM 2. weeks and weeks of product workshops to define vision/mission/goals 3. teaching the PM how the product works, who are the customers, why it works this way, all the weird business logic cruft 4. PM has a passing knowledge of the product 5. PM decides on a new questionable flashy project after 3-6 months 6. PM gets promotion (or a burnout) Rinse and repeat.
    - pmontra 3y ago
      That's a PM looking for a promotion and I'm afraid that it can't be helped. It's not the only way, somebody they get promoted without doing anything, only backstabbing other people. In a sane environment there should be user problems to solve, real problems and not invented ones, and teams that solve those problems. The PM of a team delivering the best solutions should have an advantage when looking for a promotion, that's fair. Unfortunately that means that they had a brilliant PM and they'll turn it into a maybe mediocre manager one level up and there is no way to climb down the ladder in the same company. Peter's Principle.
simmerup 3y ago
Yeah this is a part of the reason I got an iPhone. Got tired of having to relearn google’s UI every year or so.
izacus 3y ago
You can say that for a lot of things, but this maps change is a massive usability improvement despite change grumpiness. There's a reason why even Apple chose a similar color scheme.

cromka 3y ago

I remember reading this is a side effect of their corporate ladder structure, where successful projects for “new stuff” are used to self-advocate for promotion. Not unlike any other corporations, to be fair.

piva00 3y ago

Agreed, I feel it's definitely Conway's law in effect, the org structure is being delivered: PMs need promotions so will change things for the sake of change, to have something to be delivered that is not only maintenance or steady small upgrades. To get a promotion it needs to be flashier, PMs chase "impact" (whatever that means) and not a "this is a nice and consistent user experience". To the detriment of us all, users... Unfortunately I don't have many examples of large orgs being able to escape Conway's law, every larger org I've worked at has this issue. After 2 decades in tech I definitely feel the incentives are all wrong, what organisations push for the ticking box process of getting promotions is quite disconnected from the needs of users. Given enough time, inevitably, it breaks.

pmontra 3y ago
How about no incentives, just get the money at the end of the month?
- piva00 3y ago
  I'd be extremely glad for that, fucking tired of all the political games to keep churning projects a PM wanted for their promotion package, regardless how actually useful it was 2-5 years down the line, usually abandoning the team right after they jump up in their career... I haven't had a PM for longer than a year or so in a long time. Getting pretty exhausted by the endless cycles of: 1. new PM 2. weeks and weeks of product workshops to define vision/mission/goals 3. teaching the PM how the product works, who are the customers, why it works this way, all the weird business logic cruft 4. PM has a passing knowledge of the product 5. PM decides on a new questionable flashy project after 3-6 months 6. PM gets promotion (or a burnout) Rinse and repeat.
  - pmontra 3y ago
    That's a PM looking for a promotion and I'm afraid that it can't be helped. It's not the only way, somebody they get promoted without doing anything, only backstabbing other people. In a sane environment there should be user problems to solve, real problems and not invented ones, and teams that solve those problems. The PM of a team delivering the best solutions should have an advantage when looking for a promotion, that's fair. Unfortunately that means that they had a brilliant PM and they'll turn it into a maybe mediocre manager one level up and there is no way to climb down the ladder in the same company. Peter's Principle.

simmerup 3y ago

Yeah this is a part of the reason I got an iPhone. Got tired of having to relearn google’s UI every year or so.

izacus 3y ago

You can say that for a lot of things, but this maps change is a massive usability improvement despite change grumpiness. There's a reason why even Apple chose a similar color scheme.