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REAL ID act: "OFFICIAL PURPOSE- The term `official purpose' includes but is not limited to accessing Federal facilities, boarding federally regulated commercial

REAL ID act: "OFFICIAL PURPOSE- The term `official purpose' includes but is not limited to accessing Federal facilities, boarding federally regulated commercial aircraft, entering nuclear power plants, and any other purposes that the Secretary shall determine. " https://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/real-id-act-text.pdf https://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/real-id-act-text.pdf

greyface- 3y ago
This does not have the effect you claim it does. Despite significant efforts, the airport ID checking component of REAL ID has not gone into effect, after decades of can-kicking and playing chicken with individual states that haven't implemented REAL ID locally. https://www.dhs.gov/news/2022/12/05/dhs-announces-extension-real-id-full-enforcement-deadline https://www.dhs.gov/news/2022/12/05/dhs-announces-extension-...
- robcohen 3y ago
  Laws don't have to be enforced, but it's still the law. You asked for a law, and REAL ID is one. Although it isn't fully enforced, the provision for an ID is fully enforced. It's just not required to be a REAL ID, but an ID is required.
  - greyface- 3y ago
    > the provision for an ID is fully enforced Which provision, specifically, are you referring to? The REAL ID pdf you linked does not contain a "provision for an ID" in airports separate from 202(a)(1), which is not yet in effect, and will likely get snoozed for a few years again in 2025. Furthermore, even if it were in effect today, it would not require the checking of IDs; it merely prohibits the checking of non-REAL IDs.
- yummypaint 3y ago
  There is a simple experiment you can do to test this yourself. Just attempt to board a US domestic flight without showing any personal identification. You will most certainly not be allowed through security.
  - greyface- 3y ago
    The outcome is obvious - I'll be denied boarding. What that doesn't tell me, and what I was asking upthread, is whether anyone can provide a statutory justification for this, or if it's just TSA arbitrarily exercising power.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - snakeyjake 3y ago
    >You will most certainly not be allowed through security. Yes you will be. I did it. Me. Personally. If you show up at the airport and your wallet is 200 miles away and your flight is in 45 minutes they will, unquestionably, irrefutably, let you onto your flight. Step 1: Go to the counter and tell them you don't have your ID. Step 2: They typey-type on their computer and print out some stuff. Step 3: You take that stuff to TSA and they ask you some questions like "what is your address? what is your date of birth? and things like that" Step 4: They wave you through and you go to your gate and wait to board. I was told that it is not uncommon for people to forget or lose their IDs.
    - robcohen 3y ago
      Interesting. Thanks for the anecdote, I had no idea this was possible. Further validated by https://www.tsa.gov/travel/security-screening/identification#:~:text=You%20will%20not%20be%20allowed,advance%20of%20your%20flight%20time https://www.tsa.gov/travel/security-screening/identification.... I find it pretty funny that the top of the website says "Adult passengers 18 and older must show valid identification at the airport checkpoint in order to travel." Yet later in the page it says you can still travel without it.
    - yummypaint 3y ago
      Thanks for sharing, I wonder how many people miss flights because they aren't aware of this. That being said, I doubt one could get away with traveling exclusively using this method.
nullindividual 3y ago
You can fly without ID provided you can answer questions correctly. https://www.tsa.gov/travel/frequently-asked-questions/i-forgot-my-identification-can-i-still-proceed-through-security https://www.tsa.gov/travel/frequently-asked-questions/i-forg...

greyface- 3y ago

This does not have the effect you claim it does. Despite significant efforts, the airport ID checking component of REAL ID has not gone into effect, after decades of can-kicking and playing chicken with individual states that haven't implemented REAL ID locally. https://www.dhs.gov/news/2022/12/05/dhs-announces-extension-real-id-full-enforcement-deadline https://www.dhs.gov/news/2022/12/05/dhs-announces-extension-...

robcohen 3y ago
Laws don't have to be enforced, but it's still the law. You asked for a law, and REAL ID is one. Although it isn't fully enforced, the provision for an ID is fully enforced. It's just not required to be a REAL ID, but an ID is required.
- greyface- 3y ago
  > the provision for an ID is fully enforced Which provision, specifically, are you referring to? The REAL ID pdf you linked does not contain a "provision for an ID" in airports separate from 202(a)(1), which is not yet in effect, and will likely get snoozed for a few years again in 2025. Furthermore, even if it were in effect today, it would not require the checking of IDs; it merely prohibits the checking of non-REAL IDs.
yummypaint 3y ago
There is a simple experiment you can do to test this yourself. Just attempt to board a US domestic flight without showing any personal identification. You will most certainly not be allowed through security.
- greyface- 3y ago
  The outcome is obvious - I'll be denied boarding. What that doesn't tell me, and what I was asking upthread, is whether anyone can provide a statutory justification for this, or if it's just TSA arbitrarily exercising power.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- snakeyjake 3y ago
  >You will most certainly not be allowed through security. Yes you will be. I did it. Me. Personally. If you show up at the airport and your wallet is 200 miles away and your flight is in 45 minutes they will, unquestionably, irrefutably, let you onto your flight. Step 1: Go to the counter and tell them you don't have your ID. Step 2: They typey-type on their computer and print out some stuff. Step 3: You take that stuff to TSA and they ask you some questions like "what is your address? what is your date of birth? and things like that" Step 4: They wave you through and you go to your gate and wait to board. I was told that it is not uncommon for people to forget or lose their IDs.
  - robcohen 3y ago
    Interesting. Thanks for the anecdote, I had no idea this was possible. Further validated by https://www.tsa.gov/travel/security-screening/identification#:~:text=You%20will%20not%20be%20allowed,advance%20of%20your%20flight%20time https://www.tsa.gov/travel/security-screening/identification.... I find it pretty funny that the top of the website says "Adult passengers 18 and older must show valid identification at the airport checkpoint in order to travel." Yet later in the page it says you can still travel without it.
  - yummypaint 3y ago
    Thanks for sharing, I wonder how many people miss flights because they aren't aware of this. That being said, I doubt one could get away with traveling exclusively using this method.

nullindividual 3y ago

You can fly without ID provided you can answer questions correctly. https://www.tsa.gov/travel/frequently-asked-questions/i-forgot-my-identification-can-i-still-proceed-through-security https://www.tsa.gov/travel/frequently-asked-questions/i-forg...