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"Skeptical of IP law" does not mean I believe IP law should not exist. I believe copyright terms in the US are too long and should be more like 20 years, but I

"Skeptical of IP law" does not mean I believe IP law should not exist. I believe copyright terms in the US are too long and should be more like 20 years, but I do not believe everything should be a free for all where any person or any program can immediately reuse any idea.

MightyBuzzard 3y ago
Works are not ideas, they are expressions. Protecting ideas is insane.
- Arainach 3y ago
  I disagree. Protecting ideas for a limited duration is how you incentivize creation. If someone comes up with a new machine, why publish it if it's legal for every factory and large company to start producing them without compensating the inventor? Why sell it yourself if any big company can immediately clone it and undercut your price? As for "works", I also disagree. Consider music: two artists may have unique performances of a piece, but the composition exists separate from either.
  - malwrar 3y ago
    > If someone comes up with a new machine, why publish it if it's legal for every factory and large company to start producing them without compensating the inventor? Why sell it yourself if any big company can immediately clone it and undercut your price? Because you want to make money? There will always be a period in which you exclusively are manufacturing and marketing your machine, before your hypothetical evil omni-corp manages to clone it. Reverse engineering takes time, and (fair, enforced) competition on manufacturing means that we converge on the true cost to manufacture a good faster.
    - Arainach 3y ago
      That period is a matter of hours. Unless you already own a plant, the companies that produce goods produce generic clones with the same tooling after hours. New fashion trends have clones in online stores in days. Unofficial accessories and cases are available before product launches. Crowdfunded campaigns for hardware have clones on Alibaba before the funding campaign is over.
  - MightyBuzzard 3y ago
    [dead]
  - jwestbury 3y ago
    > If someone comes up with a new machine, why publish it if it's legal for every factory and large company to start producing them without compensating the inventor? Sure, this is the goal of the patent system. You'll note that patents are intended for inventions, for ideas of practical value. Artworks without practical value are explicitly not protected by the patent system, nor are ideas without the necessary design components. How would extending this system to ideas of pure form, rather than function, benefit society?
aNoob7000 3y ago
You read my mind. I personally think that the length of copyright and patents in the USA is too long. Length of time for copyright right now is life of the author plus 70. Which seems insane to me. Length of time for a patent is 20 years now.
Teever 3y ago
I agree 100pc. I also think that it's important to distinguish between IP violation for personal profits and the violation for profit. If someone is using my IP for personal enjoyment or learning that's great but if they're using it to make megabucks like openAI and others intend to do then I want my cut. https://youtu.be/8L4HHPTiZN8?si=Ex3ixajKTMzkPIHm https://youtu.be/8L4HHPTiZN8?si=Ex3ixajKTMzkPIHm

MightyBuzzard 3y ago

Works are not ideas, they are expressions. Protecting ideas is insane.

Arainach 3y ago
I disagree. Protecting ideas for a limited duration is how you incentivize creation. If someone comes up with a new machine, why publish it if it's legal for every factory and large company to start producing them without compensating the inventor? Why sell it yourself if any big company can immediately clone it and undercut your price? As for "works", I also disagree. Consider music: two artists may have unique performances of a piece, but the composition exists separate from either.
- malwrar 3y ago
  > If someone comes up with a new machine, why publish it if it's legal for every factory and large company to start producing them without compensating the inventor? Why sell it yourself if any big company can immediately clone it and undercut your price? Because you want to make money? There will always be a period in which you exclusively are manufacturing and marketing your machine, before your hypothetical evil omni-corp manages to clone it. Reverse engineering takes time, and (fair, enforced) competition on manufacturing means that we converge on the true cost to manufacture a good faster.
  - Arainach 3y ago
    That period is a matter of hours. Unless you already own a plant, the companies that produce goods produce generic clones with the same tooling after hours. New fashion trends have clones in online stores in days. Unofficial accessories and cases are available before product launches. Crowdfunded campaigns for hardware have clones on Alibaba before the funding campaign is over.
- MightyBuzzard 3y ago
  [dead]
- jwestbury 3y ago
  > If someone comes up with a new machine, why publish it if it's legal for every factory and large company to start producing them without compensating the inventor? Sure, this is the goal of the patent system. You'll note that patents are intended for inventions, for ideas of practical value. Artworks without practical value are explicitly not protected by the patent system, nor are ideas without the necessary design components. How would extending this system to ideas of pure form, rather than function, benefit society?

aNoob7000 3y ago

You read my mind. I personally think that the length of copyright and patents in the USA is too long. Length of time for copyright right now is life of the author plus 70. Which seems insane to me. Length of time for a patent is 20 years now.

Teever 3y ago

I agree 100pc. I also think that it's important to distinguish between IP violation for personal profits and the violation for profit. If someone is using my IP for personal enjoyment or learning that's great but if they're using it to make megabucks like openAI and others intend to do then I want my cut. https://youtu.be/8L4HHPTiZN8?si=Ex3ixajKTMzkPIHm https://youtu.be/8L4HHPTiZN8?si=Ex3ixajKTMzkPIHm