4 ms·

Why not both? Both are bad and both should be minimized.

verdverm 3y ago
The government has ample ways to get the same data via other means and probably more sophisticated tech. I would imagine they are well beyond this I also don't do things that would have them watching or worrying about me, so not really concerned personally and only see the upside to the government / military having this capability, with appropriate oversight (which I'm sure many will imply is non-existant) There is a valid product offering for ISPs, monitoring people for medical emergencies. I suspect this will be how it gets accepted by many people
- ifyoubuildit 3y ago
  Would you say this is any different from the classic "I have nothing to hide" argument? Edit: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nothing_to_hide_argument https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nothing_to_hide_argument
  - transpute 3y ago
    Speech surveillance has lead to self-censorship of speech. Motion surveillance can lead to self-censorship of motion.
    - verdverm 3y ago
      I think my speech has been self-censored more by the woke movement than the government. Social norms or fads seem to outweigh anything the gov't would get away with, at least in the US
      - transpute 3y ago
        WiFi and other through-wall radar sensing has been sold to governments for more than a decade, and research code/firmware/papers have been online for 5+ years. WiFi 7 Sensing expands the list of ecosystem participants to hundreds of millions, i.e. it's about scale and ubiquity, not any particular actor. No one can predict what it means to abolish opaque walls. Observations are going to alter the observed.
  - verdverm 3y ago
    not sure, I don't want the gov't to have unfettered access or capabilities, they need oversight and to provide transparency. I'd rather see them put out the reports of how many times they use it, rather than relying on companies volunteering the same information as it applies to them. At least some of them do in the absence of a self-reporting gov't agency generally, there's a balance and it tends to oscillate around that depending on larger events and trends
    - transpute 3y ago
      WiFi 7 sensing is not gov specific. It's going into commercial routers and laptops.

The government has ample ways to get the same data via other means and probably more sophisticated tech. I would imagine they are well beyond this I also don't do things that would have them watching or worrying about me, so not really concerned personally and only see the upside to the government / military having this capability, with appropriate oversight (which I'm sure many will imply is non-existant) There is a valid product offering for ISPs, monitoring people for medical emergencies. I suspect this will be how it gets accepted by many people

ifyoubuildit 3y ago
Would you say this is any different from the classic "I have nothing to hide" argument? Edit: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nothing_to_hide_argument https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nothing_to_hide_argument
- transpute 3y ago
  Speech surveillance has lead to self-censorship of speech. Motion surveillance can lead to self-censorship of motion.
  - verdverm 3y ago
    I think my speech has been self-censored more by the woke movement than the government. Social norms or fads seem to outweigh anything the gov't would get away with, at least in the US
    - transpute 3y ago
      WiFi and other through-wall radar sensing has been sold to governments for more than a decade, and research code/firmware/papers have been online for 5+ years. WiFi 7 Sensing expands the list of ecosystem participants to hundreds of millions, i.e. it's about scale and ubiquity, not any particular actor. No one can predict what it means to abolish opaque walls. Observations are going to alter the observed.
- verdverm 3y ago
  not sure, I don't want the gov't to have unfettered access or capabilities, they need oversight and to provide transparency. I'd rather see them put out the reports of how many times they use it, rather than relying on companies volunteering the same information as it applies to them. At least some of them do in the absence of a self-reporting gov't agency generally, there's a balance and it tends to oscillate around that depending on larger events and trends
  - transpute 3y ago
    WiFi 7 sensing is not gov specific. It's going into commercial routers and laptops.