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I think they're saying that you can use belief as a tool in your thinking, even if you know intellectually it's not true now and certainly won't be true always.

I think they're saying that you can use belief as a tool in your thinking, even if you know intellectually it's not true now and certainly won't be true always. The belief that you are not a victim is (often) a very useful belief because it prompts change in the only place you're reliably able to produce it: your own decisions. This is true irrespective of whether you're actually a victim today or tomorrow. Obviously if your "I am not a victim" mentality is prompting you not to leave a situation you really should be leaving, then that's a bad application. Note what happened here though: it's not the truthfulness of the belief that changed, it's the usefulness of the belief. > This is the kind of mindset that leads to people committing suicide. Citation please? That's an extremely bold claim to be throwing out as established fact.

matteoraso 3y ago
>The belief that you are not a victim is (often) a very useful belief because it prompts change in the only place you're reliably able to produce it: your own decisions. I figured that this is the angle that he was going for, but I still don't believe it. Feeling like a victim can prompt change as well, and like you said, refusing to feel like a victim can prevent change. It's all about the situation, but I think that refusing to have an honest assessment of your situation will usually cause you to make bad decisions. > Citation please? That's an extremely bold claim to be throwing out as established fact. Grieving usually takes at least 6 months[0]. Trying to speedrun the process because you refuse to let yourself feel negative emotions is literally the absolute worst way to deal with loss, to the point that I'm actually surprised that somebody actually just suggested that. Same thing with being unproductive for more than 48 hours. That's a recipe for burnout, and trying to just power through burnout for your entire life without accepting that you might need to rest for a bit will make you feel useless and depressed that you can't reach your absurdly strict self-goals. Self-hatred increases the risk of suicide[1], and I can't imagine that anybody would use this framework unless they despise themselves or have never suffered in their life. [0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK66052/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK66052/ [1] https://www.healthyplace.com/blogs/buildingselfesteem/2018/9/the-connection-between-self-hatred-and-suicide https://www.healthyplace.com/blogs/buildingselfesteem/2018/9...
jay-barronville 3y ago
> > This is the kind of mindset that leads to people committing suicide. > Citation please? That's an extremely bold claim to be throwing out as established fact. I know I’ll probably offend some folks by saying this: This is why everyone seems to expect to be coddled nowadays. Concepts like suicide are used so liberally and flippantly, and worse, they’re even weaponized at times. We’ve gone from vets committing suicide due to PTSD after being in literal war to folks considering suicide as an option the moment they feel the slightest bit of discomfort from life. I think this is really bad for society. If anything, I think learning how to take full control over your emotions—i.e., the point of my “48 hours” system—can likely actually prevent suicide (this is obviously just my hunch, not based on any studies), because it’s usually (not always) a result of someone losing hope in their ability to control their situation/outcomes and letting their emotions take over. It’s easy to see my system as robotic, but the reality is, the end result is putting the power back in my hands and allowing myself to push through. It’s worked extremely well for me.

matteoraso 3y ago

>The belief that you are not a victim is (often) a very useful belief because it prompts change in the only place you're reliably able to produce it: your own decisions. I figured that this is the angle that he was going for, but I still don't believe it. Feeling like a victim can prompt change as well, and like you said, refusing to feel like a victim can prevent change. It's all about the situation, but I think that refusing to have an honest assessment of your situation will usually cause you to make bad decisions. > Citation please? That's an extremely bold claim to be throwing out as established fact. Grieving usually takes at least 6 months[0]. Trying to speedrun the process because you refuse to let yourself feel negative emotions is literally the absolute worst way to deal with loss, to the point that I'm actually surprised that somebody actually just suggested that. Same thing with being unproductive for more than 48 hours. That's a recipe for burnout, and trying to just power through burnout for your entire life without accepting that you might need to rest for a bit will make you feel useless and depressed that you can't reach your absurdly strict self-goals. Self-hatred increases the risk of suicide[1], and I can't imagine that anybody would use this framework unless they despise themselves or have never suffered in their life. [0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK66052/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK66052/ [1] https://www.healthyplace.com/blogs/buildingselfesteem/2018/9/the-connection-between-self-hatred-and-suicide https://www.healthyplace.com/blogs/buildingselfesteem/2018/9...

jay-barronville 3y ago

> > This is the kind of mindset that leads to people committing suicide. > Citation please? That's an extremely bold claim to be throwing out as established fact. I know I’ll probably offend some folks by saying this: This is why everyone seems to expect to be coddled nowadays. Concepts like suicide are used so liberally and flippantly, and worse, they’re even weaponized at times. We’ve gone from vets committing suicide due to PTSD after being in literal war to folks considering suicide as an option the moment they feel the slightest bit of discomfort from life. I think this is really bad for society. If anything, I think learning how to take full control over your emotions—i.e., the point of my “48 hours” system—can likely actually prevent suicide (this is obviously just my hunch, not based on any studies), because it’s usually (not always) a result of someone losing hope in their ability to control their situation/outcomes and letting their emotions take over. It’s easy to see my system as robotic, but the reality is, the end result is putting the power back in my hands and allowing myself to push through. It’s worked extremely well for me.