4 ms·

I came here to say that $200/hour is only "extremely conservative" in very few and small geographic parts of the world. Where I'm from (in a large city in the U

I came here to say that $200/hour is only "extremely conservative" in very few and small geographic parts of the world. Where I'm from (in a large city in the US) this number would be described as extravagant. I've charged $200 or more on only one occasion myself, and it was a very short-term arrangement.

varispeed 3y ago
The problem is that many individual freelancers look at their work from an employee perspective, not from a business perspective. From an employee perspective $200/hour may seem extravagant, but from business perspective it is nothing. So if you hire an agency to perform a contract, they'll bill you $2000 per day and send you their employee who makes $100 an hour. Agency pockets the $1200 (it's a simplification, but should paint the picture). Freelancer and agency both run the same business model. If you think like employee and charge extravagantly less, you will never grow. You should typically charge enough, so that for any given project you could hire an employee to do the work, while you look for new leads or you can keep the money in the company and do the work yourself until you amass enough capital to move up the business ladder.
wokwokwok 3y ago
> very few and small geographic parts of the world There's reasonably good data about this that contradicts this? $1000 as a day rate isn't unusual or unreasonable for a specialist IT contractor; and I don't say that idly; I say it from both experience and you know; aggregated data: - https://www.hays.com.au/documents/276732/1102429/Hays+Technology+Contractor+Rates+Guide.pdf https://www.hays.com.au/documents/276732/1102429/Hays+Techno... - https://www.itcontracting.com/rate-checker/ https://www.itcontracting.com/rate-checker/ - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32606348 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32606348 Yes, if you want someone to slap a php website together (or javascript, or many other entry level frameworks), you can pay less. ...but that's not what they were asking; they were asking for a technically sophisticated analysis of an existing project and a performant re-implementation in rust. They got a bargain.
- twodave 3y ago
  $1000/day is $125/hr. That’s a lot less than $200/hr. That’s the difference between being a top 10% earner and a top 5% earner.
parasubvert 3y ago
I'm from a large city (but not the largest) in Canada and $200/hour or higher is common for high end devs, architects, and project managers. I charged $200/hour twenty years ago. These days I'd charge $250-300/hour if I was a contractor. It is not extravagant in most of North America, but again, it is a rate for higher end talent. I have not charged less than $150/hour since the 90s. I once had some contractors in my team that were paid $500/hour due to vendor markup. I consider that extravagant.
- fnordpiglet 3y ago
  Yeah when I was a contractor in 1996 Mountain View $200 was table stakes for someone with non trivial technical skills.
- wredue 3y ago
  I’ll second this that even in Canada, which has quite low tech pay, the lower end of quality dev work is $180/hr. Most of us managing contractors wouldn’t blink twice at $200/hr. Many of the bills are much higher.
  - jihiggins 3y ago
    where are you finding these rates at? i have rarely seen anything even passing $100/hr in canada, contract or not
    - fooster 3y ago
      Dude I got $1000 a day in Canada in the early 90s. You just need the right skills and contacts.
    - parasubvert 3y ago
      IT developers are often around $100/hour outside Toronto, Toronto being a bit more. Upwards of $150-200 if its speciality work or you're a team lead. It varies though, the market also exists for $80/hour java developers, which tend to be new grads Contract Developers going to technical companies will earn more like $180+.

varispeed 3y ago

The problem is that many individual freelancers look at their work from an employee perspective, not from a business perspective. From an employee perspective $200/hour may seem extravagant, but from business perspective it is nothing. So if you hire an agency to perform a contract, they'll bill you $2000 per day and send you their employee who makes $100 an hour. Agency pockets the $1200 (it's a simplification, but should paint the picture). Freelancer and agency both run the same business model. If you think like employee and charge extravagantly less, you will never grow. You should typically charge enough, so that for any given project you could hire an employee to do the work, while you look for new leads or you can keep the money in the company and do the work yourself until you amass enough capital to move up the business ladder.

wokwokwok 3y ago

> very few and small geographic parts of the world There's reasonably good data about this that contradicts this? $1000 as a day rate isn't unusual or unreasonable for a specialist IT contractor; and I don't say that idly; I say it from both experience and you know; aggregated data: - https://www.hays.com.au/documents/276732/1102429/Hays+Technology+Contractor+Rates+Guide.pdf https://www.hays.com.au/documents/276732/1102429/Hays+Techno... - https://www.itcontracting.com/rate-checker/ https://www.itcontracting.com/rate-checker/ - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32606348 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32606348 Yes, if you want someone to slap a php website together (or javascript, or many other entry level frameworks), you can pay less. ...but that's not what they were asking; they were asking for a technically sophisticated analysis of an existing project and a performant re-implementation in rust. They got a bargain.

twodave 3y ago
$1000/day is $125/hr. That’s a lot less than $200/hr. That’s the difference between being a top 10% earner and a top 5% earner.

parasubvert 3y ago

I'm from a large city (but not the largest) in Canada and $200/hour or higher is common for high end devs, architects, and project managers. I charged $200/hour twenty years ago. These days I'd charge $250-300/hour if I was a contractor. It is not extravagant in most of North America, but again, it is a rate for higher end talent. I have not charged less than $150/hour since the 90s. I once had some contractors in my team that were paid $500/hour due to vendor markup. I consider that extravagant.

fnordpiglet 3y ago
Yeah when I was a contractor in 1996 Mountain View $200 was table stakes for someone with non trivial technical skills.
wredue 3y ago
I’ll second this that even in Canada, which has quite low tech pay, the lower end of quality dev work is $180/hr. Most of us managing contractors wouldn’t blink twice at $200/hr. Many of the bills are much higher.
- jihiggins 3y ago
  where are you finding these rates at? i have rarely seen anything even passing $100/hr in canada, contract or not
  - fooster 3y ago
    Dude I got $1000 a day in Canada in the early 90s. You just need the right skills and contacts.
  - parasubvert 3y ago
    IT developers are often around $100/hour outside Toronto, Toronto being a bit more. Upwards of $150-200 if its speciality work or you're a team lead. It varies though, the market also exists for $80/hour java developers, which tend to be new grads Contract Developers going to technical companies will earn more like $180+.