4 ms·

I had the same thought when I learned the kid was learning Hebrew. Kind of a tell. I mean I don't want to discredit the possibility this helps a lot, let's ju

I had the same thought when I learned the kid was learning Hebrew. Kind of a tell. I mean I don't want to discredit the possibility this helps a lot, let's just be real about the likely baseline.

SuperNinKenDo 3y ago
Frankly kids are language sponges. Just pop a kid in proximity to somebody speaking another language for a couple hours every few days, and they'll start being able to speak it at a basic level after less than a year. Teaching a kid a language using flashcards is obviously different, but I don't think it indicates some kind of savant status by any stretch.
- edanm 3y ago
  That's a huge generalization. There are many kids with speech delays, for example.
  - SuperNinKenDo 3y ago
    Yes. It is a huge generalisation. About the general case. Which is that kids don't have delays. That's why they're called delays. And that is why not having a delay does not indicate savant status.
    - edanm 3y ago
      Yeah I was just responding to the first of your statement, I agree with the second. (There are a significant amount of kids with some developmental delay, and it can be disheartening to be the parent of a kid and think you're doing something wrong because "everyone knows" that "all kids pick up languages like sponges", that' the only reason I want to call it out as not being representative of everyone.)
      - SuperNinKenDo 3y ago
        I guess it's true that talking about these things as universal can have rhat effect. On the other hand, and not necessarily disagreeing with you, but playing devil's advocate a little here; sometimes it's important to make clear what normal development does look like so that a parent of a child with delays understands confidently that what they're seeing isn't normal development. An acquaintance of mine has a son who's clearly delayed, probably autistic, but she's so steeped in "every child is different" rhetoric that she refuses to see the obvious, and it's going to be to his serious detriment unfortunately. I guess the trick is to describe clearly what is normal while also cultivating a culture in which there's no shame attached to these kinds of delays.
        edanm 3y ago
        I agree with the gist of your post, I think I'd just say that, when making observations, it's careful to qualify them. Instead of "kids are like sponges with languages" you can say "most kids are like sponges with languages". (I'm nitpicking, my comments aren't trying to say you did something wrong - I just wanted to point out that what you said only applies to most kids, not all.)
beagle3 3y ago
In general, Hebrew with vowels (as it is usually taught to beginners) has well specified pronunciation. The emphasis is usually not written, which does occasionally leave a degree of freedom, but it’s much easier than English with its thousands of special cases (e.g. lower vs power, colonel in American English). Everyday use does not use the vowels, and you are just supposed to know it or decide it from context - which is harder than in English, even though English has its share of difficulty here (e.g. the two ‘tear’s in “i shed a tear when I saw him tear the contract”) And in case the missing vowels sound confusing - Hebrew and Arabic put vowels above and below the letters, not inline signaling like English.
- justrealist 3y ago
  That's not my point, it's that if they are Ashkenazi they are on average starting at 1-2 SD above baseline.
- Terr_ 3y ago
  > much easier than English with its thousands of special cases Relevant comic: https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/pronounce https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/pronounce

I had the same thought when I learned the kid was learning Hebrew. Kind of a tell. I mean I don't want to discredit the possibility this helps a lot, let's just be real about the likely baseline.

SuperNinKenDo 3y ago

Frankly kids are language sponges. Just pop a kid in proximity to somebody speaking another language for a couple hours every few days, and they'll start being able to speak it at a basic level after less than a year. Teaching a kid a language using flashcards is obviously different, but I don't think it indicates some kind of savant status by any stretch.

edanm 3y ago
That's a huge generalization. There are many kids with speech delays, for example.
- SuperNinKenDo 3y ago
  Yes. It is a huge generalisation. About the general case. Which is that kids don't have delays. That's why they're called delays. And that is why not having a delay does not indicate savant status.
  - edanm 3y ago
    Yeah I was just responding to the first of your statement, I agree with the second. (There are a significant amount of kids with some developmental delay, and it can be disheartening to be the parent of a kid and think you're doing something wrong because "everyone knows" that "all kids pick up languages like sponges", that' the only reason I want to call it out as not being representative of everyone.)
    - SuperNinKenDo 3y ago
      I guess it's true that talking about these things as universal can have rhat effect. On the other hand, and not necessarily disagreeing with you, but playing devil's advocate a little here; sometimes it's important to make clear what normal development does look like so that a parent of a child with delays understands confidently that what they're seeing isn't normal development. An acquaintance of mine has a son who's clearly delayed, probably autistic, but she's so steeped in "every child is different" rhetoric that she refuses to see the obvious, and it's going to be to his serious detriment unfortunately. I guess the trick is to describe clearly what is normal while also cultivating a culture in which there's no shame attached to these kinds of delays.
      - edanm 3y ago
        I agree with the gist of your post, I think I'd just say that, when making observations, it's careful to qualify them. Instead of "kids are like sponges with languages" you can say "most kids are like sponges with languages". (I'm nitpicking, my comments aren't trying to say you did something wrong - I just wanted to point out that what you said only applies to most kids, not all.)

beagle3 3y ago

In general, Hebrew with vowels (as it is usually taught to beginners) has well specified pronunciation. The emphasis is usually not written, which does occasionally leave a degree of freedom, but it’s much easier than English with its thousands of special cases (e.g. lower vs power, colonel in American English). Everyday use does not use the vowels, and you are just supposed to know it or decide it from context - which is harder than in English, even though English has its share of difficulty here (e.g. the two ‘tear’s in “i shed a tear when I saw him tear the contract”) And in case the missing vowels sound confusing - Hebrew and Arabic put vowels above and below the letters, not inline signaling like English.

justrealist 3y ago
That's not my point, it's that if they are Ashkenazi they are on average starting at 1-2 SD above baseline.
Terr_ 3y ago
> much easier than English with its thousands of special cases Relevant comic: https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/pronounce https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/pronounce