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> Spaghetti junction is an understatement, whoever worked on this, and had any role in it other than saying “this is awful” should be barred from working on inf

by davely 3y ago

> Spaghetti junction is an understatement, whoever worked on this, and had any role in it other than saying “this is awful” should be barred from working on infrastructure ever again and be made to sit in the corner and think about what they’ve done. I grew up in Southern California and there was a notoriously horrible interchange (the 60 / 91 / 215) I had to navigate each day driving to university. The rumor that people liked to spread (completely unfounded, I’m sure), is that the engineer responsible for it killed themselves because of how bad it was and how many accidents occurred. I imagine this same sort of rumor is repeated about various interchanges the world over. EDIT: There are much more ridiculous looking intersections, but an interesting LA Times article on the interchange from 2007. [1] An improvement project that rebuilt the interchange was completed in 2007. [2] [1] https://www.latimes.com/local/la-me-freeway21sep21-story.html https://www.latimes.com/local/la-me-freeway21sep21-story.htm... [2] https://www.caltrop.com/project-details/sr60-sr91-i215-interchange/ https://www.caltrop.com/project-details/sr60-sr91-i215-inter...

noduerme 3y ago
I grew up in LA and drove taxi... just looking at the 60/(91/215), it looks pretty standard and not that different from the 10/215, but I don't think I've ever taken that exit from the 60. As enormous as SoCal freeway interchanges are, I've come to appreciate their design compared to the roads where I live now in Portland, OR. Every on- and off-ramp in Portland feels like it was tacked on or squeezed in, in the worst possible way. Moreover, the marking of exits is confusing and far too late. For out-of-town drivers it's almost impossible to don't know which side of a freeway will actually keep you on the freeway until you get to a sign, by which time you've already passed a mile of stopped cars in the lane you need to be in. The 26/405 junction heading east on 26, for example, splits the 3-lane highway into 3 exits, only one of which connects to the 405 and later splits into north and south (the other two connect to surface streets). This creates a condition where the center lane is moving fast between two lines of stopped cars, some of whom are anxiously realizing they're in the wrong lane and need to dive into the center, while some people in the center hit the brakes when they realize they need to dive into the stopped cars left or right.
mynegation 3y ago
Do you mean this one: https://maps.app.goo.gl/kF1PuDcgMotp91JR7?g_st=ic https://maps.app.goo.gl/kF1PuDcgMotp91JR7?g_st=ic I am sure I am missing few details never having driven through it, but looks like pretty standard highway interchange. For comparison, here is the one I navigate regularly and would describe as mildly challenging: https://maps.app.goo.gl/S4zX6rXJt8dpBXig6?g_st=ic https://maps.app.goo.gl/S4zX6rXJt8dpBXig6?g_st=ic
- davely 3y ago
  Yeah, looking at a map, it looks pretty vanilla and I'm not sure why it had such a notorious reputation at this point. If I recall, I think the original was a cloverleaf design, so in every direction you had people merging on and off in a span of about 300 feet. Ah, yeah. It was renovated in 2007. [1] An LA Times article on its reputation is here. [2] > And there are plenty of accidents. Sgt. Morrison of the California Highway Patrol estimates that his officers respond to about 30 calls a day in and around the interchange. They handle fender-benders, stalled cars and the occasional 20-car pileup. That said, either way, it is pretty vanilla compared to the legit spaghetti mentioned in the article with regard to the Sydney interchange. [1] https://www.caltrop.com/project-details/sr60-sr91-i215-interchange/ https://www.caltrop.com/project-details/sr60-sr91-i215-inter... [2] https://www.latimes.com/local/la-me-freeway21sep21-story.html https://www.latimes.com/local/la-me-freeway21sep21-story.htm...

by davely 3y ago

noduerme 3y ago

I grew up in LA and drove taxi... just looking at the 60/(91/215), it looks pretty standard and not that different from the 10/215, but I don't think I've ever taken that exit from the 60. As enormous as SoCal freeway interchanges are, I've come to appreciate their design compared to the roads where I live now in Portland, OR. Every on- and off-ramp in Portland feels like it was tacked on or squeezed in, in the worst possible way. Moreover, the marking of exits is confusing and far too late. For out-of-town drivers it's almost impossible to don't know which side of a freeway will actually keep you on the freeway until you get to a sign, by which time you've already passed a mile of stopped cars in the lane you need to be in. The 26/405 junction heading east on 26, for example, splits the 3-lane highway into 3 exits, only one of which connects to the 405 and later splits into north and south (the other two connect to surface streets). This creates a condition where the center lane is moving fast between two lines of stopped cars, some of whom are anxiously realizing they're in the wrong lane and need to dive into the center, while some people in the center hit the brakes when they realize they need to dive into the stopped cars left or right.

mynegation 3y ago

Do you mean this one: https://maps.app.goo.gl/kF1PuDcgMotp91JR7?g_st=ic https://maps.app.goo.gl/kF1PuDcgMotp91JR7?g_st=ic I am sure I am missing few details never having driven through it, but looks like pretty standard highway interchange. For comparison, here is the one I navigate regularly and would describe as mildly challenging: https://maps.app.goo.gl/S4zX6rXJt8dpBXig6?g_st=ic https://maps.app.goo.gl/S4zX6rXJt8dpBXig6?g_st=ic

davely 3y ago
Yeah, looking at a map, it looks pretty vanilla and I'm not sure why it had such a notorious reputation at this point. If I recall, I think the original was a cloverleaf design, so in every direction you had people merging on and off in a span of about 300 feet. Ah, yeah. It was renovated in 2007. [1] An LA Times article on its reputation is here. [2] > And there are plenty of accidents. Sgt. Morrison of the California Highway Patrol estimates that his officers respond to about 30 calls a day in and around the interchange. They handle fender-benders, stalled cars and the occasional 20-car pileup. That said, either way, it is pretty vanilla compared to the legit spaghetti mentioned in the article with regard to the Sydney interchange. [1] https://www.caltrop.com/project-details/sr60-sr91-i215-interchange/ https://www.caltrop.com/project-details/sr60-sr91-i215-inter... [2] https://www.latimes.com/local/la-me-freeway21sep21-story.html https://www.latimes.com/local/la-me-freeway21sep21-story.htm...