3 ms·

I hate those types of "research" that base all their "findings" on observation of what is undesirable primitive living. What's more they don't even meaningfully

by seec 3y ago

I hate those types of "research" that base all their "findings" on observation of what is undesirable primitive living. What's more they don't even meaningfully quantify what can be qualified as neglect or abuse. My opinion as well as my own experience is that those children are far more likely to be subjected to much higher levels of abuse and neglect in this type of situation. As someone who has been neglected by his parents very early in life, and been given to be taken care of by various family members/friends/institutions I cannot wish this for anyone. You will forever wear a feeling of abandonment and insecurity that is unfixable. That someone seriously pushes this as a valid method for raising kids is beyond ridiculous and just shows how disconnected from reality modern "researcher" can be. It also entirely removes the principle of responsibility in reproduction. We are conscientious animals and we have a responsibility to not reproduce if it is suboptimal to do so. The problems we face right now as a species are precisely because we created a system that removed many of the problems preventing too large reproduction but without also enforcing full responsibility (without the modern support system the sentence would be death). I get pissed off at all of this nonsense modern take. We had a system; it was working pretty well. In fact, it successfully kickstarted the industrial revolution and continued until relatively recently. Then feminism happened and suddenly nothing works. Women are the only one biologically able to create new humans and they have all the necessary toolkit to grow them to maturity; up to the point they are ready and stable as humans to be able to learn and collaborate with others. But we destroyed all that, following dangerous ideologies that distort reality. And now we going to "fix it" by going back to primitive behavior. I guess that's a way to go full circle, no very efficient, but that's a way alright...

watwut 3y ago
> We had a system; it was working pretty well. In fact, it successfully kickstarted the industrial revolution You mean like when both parents worked 12 hours a day 6 days a week and 3-4 years old roamed streets in little gangs? Older siblings and other relatives worked those 12 plus hours a day too. That was industrial revolution and actual situation. In Germany, it led to kindergartens - you know so that 4 years olds have a place to go to.
eastbound 3y ago
I’ve been down this alley. No-one will understand you. Now I just moved back to being a normal person seemingly integrated and all in favour of feminism and all this shit, and I just laugh internally every time a woman tells me “I have been raped.” In my city, they add “But don’t tell anyone, it will make people racist.” Every. Single. Time. Ahh, it’s already bad enough that I know several of them. Not very healthy, but you have to admit that you can’t do anything about it, they’re not asking you for advice before they do it. So just take that popcorn and move on. Kids being disenfranchised? Kids abandoned? Needing state benefits for studies because they only have a single monster as a parent? Cousin getting mugged on the street? Throwing away a perfectly working system? Promoting the criminals while abandoning the adorable pupils? Take some distance. You can’t do anything. And if you promote the good thing, they’ll take revenge upon you. People actually want all of those quirks in the system.
- watwut 3y ago
  Criminality is historically pretty low now. So is interpersonal violence including domestic violence and rapes.
- seec 3y ago
  Well, I know people try very hard to not understand. So, they don't have to feel concerned and actually do stuff to fix it. That's how people are generally, let's just ignore everything until the house is on fire... But that doesn't make it much less frustrating. And to be honest there are more and more people understanding my view in between words telling me their stories and ultimately agreeing. I have to say that is somewhat necessary because otherwise it makes you feel crazy for being the only one that can see. Like giant permanent gaslighting... And yeah, people are still delusional but the stats keep telling the same story. At some point we are going to run out of prison and benefits for single moms I guess...
  - Apocryphon 3y ago
    Is single motherhood still the bogeyman as during the era of 90s entitlement reform? In these times when the younger generations are having less and less sex, much less getting pregnant? You might as well be complaining about Cadillac driving welfare queens.
em-bee 3y ago
i am sorry for your experience. i can relate to a degree. my first thought when reading "given to be taken care of by various family members" was: at least you had family members who cared for you (as in showed you loving care). i didn't even have that. (except for my grandmother who was to far away to see her more than once a year) on the other hand i didn't develop a feeling of abandonment and i came out of the experience with extreme independence and strong self confidence. my brother wasn't so lucky. however on second reading i had to realize that i can't judge the quality of care that you did get. likely it may have been worse than anything i had to go through. again, i am sorry for that. the common point though is that we both had something missing when growing up. for me it took decades to understand what what missing and more importantly how that affected me. but most importantly, neither your nor my experience have anything to do with the experience described in the article. the key difference is that while the children in the article have many caregivers, and possibly spend a lot of time away from their parents, they didn't get any feeling of abandonment from them. your experience is something entirely different, and rejecting the living arrangements described in the article is the wrong conclusion. that your parents abandoned you had nothing to do with the community you were in. that community didn't make them do that. my parents couldn't show love because of the experience they had growing up during and right after the second world war, having to flee approaching armies and then living in a destroyed city giving them an experience that is hard to imagine. in my case, living closer to grandparents and cousins would have made a big difference. i was able to make up for the shortfall by finding a loving and caring partner. my brother needed therapy.

by seec 3y ago

watwut 3y ago

> We had a system; it was working pretty well. In fact, it successfully kickstarted the industrial revolution You mean like when both parents worked 12 hours a day 6 days a week and 3-4 years old roamed streets in little gangs? Older siblings and other relatives worked those 12 plus hours a day too. That was industrial revolution and actual situation. In Germany, it led to kindergartens - you know so that 4 years olds have a place to go to.

eastbound 3y ago

I’ve been down this alley. No-one will understand you. Now I just moved back to being a normal person seemingly integrated and all in favour of feminism and all this shit, and I just laugh internally every time a woman tells me “I have been raped.” In my city, they add “But don’t tell anyone, it will make people racist.” Every. Single. Time. Ahh, it’s already bad enough that I know several of them. Not very healthy, but you have to admit that you can’t do anything about it, they’re not asking you for advice before they do it. So just take that popcorn and move on. Kids being disenfranchised? Kids abandoned? Needing state benefits for studies because they only have a single monster as a parent? Cousin getting mugged on the street? Throwing away a perfectly working system? Promoting the criminals while abandoning the adorable pupils? Take some distance. You can’t do anything. And if you promote the good thing, they’ll take revenge upon you. People actually want all of those quirks in the system.

watwut 3y ago
Criminality is historically pretty low now. So is interpersonal violence including domestic violence and rapes.
seec 3y ago
Well, I know people try very hard to not understand. So, they don't have to feel concerned and actually do stuff to fix it. That's how people are generally, let's just ignore everything until the house is on fire... But that doesn't make it much less frustrating. And to be honest there are more and more people understanding my view in between words telling me their stories and ultimately agreeing. I have to say that is somewhat necessary because otherwise it makes you feel crazy for being the only one that can see. Like giant permanent gaslighting... And yeah, people are still delusional but the stats keep telling the same story. At some point we are going to run out of prison and benefits for single moms I guess...
- Apocryphon 3y ago
  Is single motherhood still the bogeyman as during the era of 90s entitlement reform? In these times when the younger generations are having less and less sex, much less getting pregnant? You might as well be complaining about Cadillac driving welfare queens.

em-bee 3y ago

i am sorry for your experience. i can relate to a degree. my first thought when reading "given to be taken care of by various family members" was: at least you had family members who cared for you (as in showed you loving care). i didn't even have that. (except for my grandmother who was to far away to see her more than once a year) on the other hand i didn't develop a feeling of abandonment and i came out of the experience with extreme independence and strong self confidence. my brother wasn't so lucky. however on second reading i had to realize that i can't judge the quality of care that you did get. likely it may have been worse than anything i had to go through. again, i am sorry for that. the common point though is that we both had something missing when growing up. for me it took decades to understand what what missing and more importantly how that affected me. but most importantly, neither your nor my experience have anything to do with the experience described in the article. the key difference is that while the children in the article have many caregivers, and possibly spend a lot of time away from their parents, they didn't get any feeling of abandonment from them. your experience is something entirely different, and rejecting the living arrangements described in the article is the wrong conclusion. that your parents abandoned you had nothing to do with the community you were in. that community didn't make them do that. my parents couldn't show love because of the experience they had growing up during and right after the second world war, having to flee approaching armies and then living in a destroyed city giving them an experience that is hard to imagine. in my case, living closer to grandparents and cousins would have made a big difference. i was able to make up for the shortfall by finding a loving and caring partner. my brother needed therapy.