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If a naked picture of you is causing you to choose suicide I think we need to fix how society views nudity. The answer isn't to make nudity illegal. We're goi

by ipaddr 3y ago

If a naked picture of you is causing you to choose suicide I think we need to fix how society views nudity. The answer isn't to make nudity illegal. We're going to end up blinding ourselves on purpose to avoid seeing our own nudity if we go down your road.

Spivak 3y ago
It's not a naked photo. It's 1. Complete loss of privacy and control over your image. 2. Shame and embarrassment, especially in high school where every boy will look at you different and reduce you to a sexual object. 3. Public humiliation -- those photos can and do lead to ridicule and bullying. You're the one who is naked while everyone else is clothed. 4. Destroys self-esteem -- high school is already terrible in this regard but it's hard to have any kind of self worth when a sex object and some porn is how your classmates know you. 5. Takes away your agency -- its doesn't matter if the photos aren't real, they can make you do anything in those photos and to a 3rd party viewer there's no difference. 6. It's degrading -- they're not gonna be tasteful nudes and pretending as such is naive. And it doesn't matter if you don't find the acts degrading when everyone else does. It's not making nudity illegal, it's making and distributing sexually explicit images of a person whiteout their consent illegal.
- ipaddr 3y ago
  Some bullies make people feel shameful for getting an `A' in highschool. The humiliation and self-esteem happens. If someone succeeds at a high level others try to bring them down. The answer isn't to make getting an 'A' illegal. The answer is to challenge the bullying and to not to allow it to gain power.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- Permik 3y ago
  It's just a naked photo, you're just describing a broken (social/social hierarchy) system. Don't hate the players (bully, bullied), hate the game.
  - pxoe 3y ago
    Banning non-consensual nude imagery would "fix" that "broken system". The "game" would be fixed, if those games would be made illegal. So why don't you like that as a solution? Is it supposed to be just "hated" without actually being fixed? You're conflating 'nudity' in general, and non-consensual generated nude images, but like, these things are just different, and are treated differently. There isn't a misunderstanding that nudity in, say, art, is different from nudity in porn, or that there's difference between consensual and nonconsensual depictions, or whether something involves made-up characters and real people. So why insist on conflating these two just for the sake of 'throwing hands' like problems there can't be solved, and that some specific, more narrow set of problems can't have a solution on it's own, when it can.
    - Permik 3y ago
      Hi, it seems you missed my point. I was trying to convey a more extreme holistic situation where there simply isn't a consequence of someone sharing a nude picture of someone, people just shrugging and saying "so what? It's perfectly normal to be naked". By breaking the underlying system of shame and embarrassment of someone being nude, there isn't anything to gain from it after that. Then there isn't a reason to even make it illegal anymore. (Other than just not wanting your person to be pictured at all, just basic privacy, no need to put different value to different parts of the body)
pxoe 3y ago
and it's not making nudity illegal, it's about nonconsensual creation and distribution of images with nudity. which may be connected with bullying, blackmail, extortion, or may not be. >If a naked picture of you is causing you to choose suicide really great response. almost as good as 'if rape is causing you to choose suicide'. 'maybe we need to fix how society views rape'. nonconsensual nude imagery and pornography is much closer to rape than not.

by ipaddr 3y ago

Spivak 3y ago

It's not a naked photo. It's 1. Complete loss of privacy and control over your image. 2. Shame and embarrassment, especially in high school where every boy will look at you different and reduce you to a sexual object. 3. Public humiliation -- those photos can and do lead to ridicule and bullying. You're the one who is naked while everyone else is clothed. 4. Destroys self-esteem -- high school is already terrible in this regard but it's hard to have any kind of self worth when a sex object and some porn is how your classmates know you. 5. Takes away your agency -- its doesn't matter if the photos aren't real, they can make you do anything in those photos and to a 3rd party viewer there's no difference. 6. It's degrading -- they're not gonna be tasteful nudes and pretending as such is naive. And it doesn't matter if you don't find the acts degrading when everyone else does. It's not making nudity illegal, it's making and distributing sexually explicit images of a person whiteout their consent illegal.

ipaddr 3y ago
Some bullies make people feel shameful for getting an `A' in highschool. The humiliation and self-esteem happens. If someone succeeds at a high level others try to bring them down. The answer isn't to make getting an 'A' illegal. The answer is to challenge the bullying and to not to allow it to gain power.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
Permik 3y ago
It's just a naked photo, you're just describing a broken (social/social hierarchy) system. Don't hate the players (bully, bullied), hate the game.
- pxoe 3y ago
  Banning non-consensual nude imagery would "fix" that "broken system". The "game" would be fixed, if those games would be made illegal. So why don't you like that as a solution? Is it supposed to be just "hated" without actually being fixed? You're conflating 'nudity' in general, and non-consensual generated nude images, but like, these things are just different, and are treated differently. There isn't a misunderstanding that nudity in, say, art, is different from nudity in porn, or that there's difference between consensual and nonconsensual depictions, or whether something involves made-up characters and real people. So why insist on conflating these two just for the sake of 'throwing hands' like problems there can't be solved, and that some specific, more narrow set of problems can't have a solution on it's own, when it can.
  - Permik 3y ago
    Hi, it seems you missed my point. I was trying to convey a more extreme holistic situation where there simply isn't a consequence of someone sharing a nude picture of someone, people just shrugging and saying "so what? It's perfectly normal to be naked". By breaking the underlying system of shame and embarrassment of someone being nude, there isn't anything to gain from it after that. Then there isn't a reason to even make it illegal anymore. (Other than just not wanting your person to be pictured at all, just basic privacy, no need to put different value to different parts of the body)

pxoe 3y ago

and it's not making nudity illegal, it's about nonconsensual creation and distribution of images with nudity. which may be connected with bullying, blackmail, extortion, or may not be. >If a naked picture of you is causing you to choose suicide really great response. almost as good as 'if rape is causing you to choose suicide'. 'maybe we need to fix how society views rape'. nonconsensual nude imagery and pornography is much closer to rape than not.