8 ms·

New Wave Sci-Fi: 75 Best Novels of 1964–1983

163 points by webmaven 3y ago

kramerger 3y ago
Hugged to death already https://web.archive.org/web/20231109133450/https://www.hilobrow.com/new-wave-sci-fi/ https://web.archive.org/web/20231109133450/https://www.hilob...
daoboy 3y ago
It is interesting to see how a handful of writers (especially Phillip K Dick!) really dominated the genre. Also a few forgotten gems I am going to have to reread now.
- kramerger 3y ago
  I feel this was the winter of sci-fi. I enjoyed Dune and Androids but the rest are mostly meh. A lot of DNF books for me (including Slaughterhouse-Five, which I know has its fans but I really disliked)
  - aardvark179 3y ago
    I couldn’t disagree more. The new wave is where SF starts to get interesting for me, and is when a lot of my favourite authors got started.
  - sctb 3y ago
    I'm curious to hear more about why you feel this was the winter of sci-fi! Can you share some more besides personal preference? (I'm not a huge Vonnegut fan or even big reader in general and Slaughterhouse-Five and Cat's Cradle were pretty far from DNF for me.)
  - ajmurmann 3y ago
    I feel similarly. However, I absolutely love Vonnegut, but don't see his work as scifi. Sure it has all the elements, but the themes are mostly different. To me the best scifi is about a technology that could exist and plays through all the consequences. Slaughterhouse Five isn't that, it's about WWII. (From my definition one might guess correctly that I see space opera as a derogatory term)
    - kramerger 3y ago
      I heard that his writing could have been a way to process what he went through during the war. That could explain the darkness. There is a modern fantasy writer that writes quite dark stories. I read that this is because of a very sick family member, and some of his best books have been written in a hospital room. While I applaude both for turning something bad into something good, these sort of books are just not my cup of tea. And I think a lot of people are like me. We read books to get away from the problems of real life, not dive into other people's troubled minds.
      - ajmurmann 3y ago
        "And I think a lot of people are like me. We read books to get away from the problems of real life, not dive into other people's troubled minds." That certainly makes sense and is of course also a subjective preference. To me great insights lie in the darkness, but it isn't for everyone and not at any time.
- PaulHoule 3y ago
  I like the list. It's the kind of list an English professor might make, not necessarily a sci-fi fan. In particular, Dick's genius was recognized only after his death. Even though sci-fi sometimes rises above other genre literature, it's not taken that seriously by literary types. Baudrillard talks a lot about Dick and Ballard and that's it. Stanislaw Lem (whose Cyberiad ought to be on that list instead of The Futurological Congress) himself said that Phillip K. Dick was on a whole other level than other sci-fi writers. Notably the list subverts the category of "novel" by adding a lot of things (comic books, concept albums) that aren't really novels. I think Fred Pohl is missing (say Gateway) and also Joe Halderman (Worlds!). I'd rather see any Frank Herbert book but Dune (say Whipping Star or The Santaroga Barrier.) For that matter I'd like to see something from Heinlein before he had the stroke like The Moon is a Harsh Mistress or Glory Road. I'd also want to see Niven's Neutron Star (a set of short stories that read like a novel) but despite some "new wave" sensibilities Niven comes across as reactionary today because the Tor Books revival (Forge of God and Enders Game) of sci-fi in the 1980s liked Heinlein and Niven and Doc Smith better than LeGunn, Dick, Ballard, Herbert, etc. On the other hand, put a sci-fi fan in charge of making this list and it's no doubt they'll add a stick of books from some author who is a "no account" in literary circles like Piers Anthony -- still I would try to slip him in at his most psychedelic.
  - routerl 3y ago
    > Dick's genius was recognized only after his death. Which we should give credit for: I only found PKD due to Jonathan Lethem's advocacy. PKD fans are likely to enjoy Lethem's sci-fi, especially Gun, With Occasional Music. The crew of writers responsible for elevating PKD from pulp to cult deserve some attention, especially from PKD fans (aka "Dick-heads", which is just the most perfect name for a fandom). > I'd like to see something from Heinlein before he had the stroke like The Moon is a Harsh Mistress Plus one for The Moon is a Harsh Mistress. That's probably the best of Heinlein's work.
    - getwiththeprog 3y ago
      Very rarely can I say with all sincerity "I am a Dick-Head"
- mbb70 3y ago
  Pkd was a genius, an addict, and most importantly, got paid by the page. Jonathan Letham's Amnesia Moon (mentioned at the bottom) is my favorite "how pkd would write if he weren't ripped on speed 24/7" Guess it's time to reread it. And ubik, and fmytps, and the lathe of heaven, and hyperion, and embassytown and...
  - sonofhans 3y ago
    If you haven’t, check out “Philip K Dick is Dead, Alas,” by Micheal Bishop. Same vibes — Dick without the speed :)
vodou 3y ago
I really love this era of sci-fi, a kind of short window between the immature boy fantasies before and the dull hard SF the came after. The weirdness, the hallucinatory, the craziness! And most importantly, so many great writers.
- windowshopping 3y ago
  Enders game, speaker for the dead, ringworld, and many others are post-1983. Are those dull hard sci fi?
  - demondemidi 3y ago
    "Ender's Game" is a little boy fantasy, almost literally.
  - ur-whale 3y ago
    > Enders game, speaker for the dead Truly not in the same category as stuff from e.g. PKD, by a very wide margin, especially speaker for the dead.
    - windowshopping 3y ago
      Well, matter of opinion, and judging by critics' lists your opinion is the minority.
  - zem 3y ago
    not to mention the vorkosigan series!
- ur-whale 3y ago
  > the dull hard SF the came after To be fair to the crowd that came after, the average consumption of creativity-enhancing substances was a lot less in the 80's and forward than in the [60's, early 80's] period.
- andybak 3y ago
  Doesn't Hard SF both predate and postdate New Wave? It's a thread that weaves through the whole of science-fiction. (heck - didn't Jules Verne once diss H.G. Wells for not being "hard sci-fi enough"?)
demondemidi 3y ago
It's really hard to overstate the impact of PKD's later works and JG Ballard. Having read about 50% of this list, I think all of our modern dystopia, paranoia, and existential SciFi sprouted from their insane seeds. And the depth of LeGuin's exploration of social, sexual, and economic identity in alien worlds sticks out like a sore thumb compared to her peers. Damn, tho, the book cover for The Three Stigmata... is fascinating. I always pictured him as just a cyborg octogenarian but now I can't unsee this. I miss that artwork. Aaaaand, it would be nice of the page author would put these in a CSV at the bottom so that I can make a checklist!
- PaulDavisThe1st 3y ago
  I don't know enough to know if your ascription of those "ills" to those authors is accurate, but I certainly find it refreshing to see someone asserting that no, it's not "just fiction" and the art we create and consume changes us, and changes society, not always in a good way.
  - retrocryptid 3y ago
    I've often thought that if the American libertarian party renamed themselves "The LeGuin Party" they might get a lot more members.
    - runeofdoom 3y ago
      Such members would be unlikely to support their "I've got mine, fuck you" ideology.
      - darthrupert 3y ago
        You're thinking of communists, establishment conservatists and wealthy progressives. Libertarians are the opposite of that.
        deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
ranprieur 3y ago
It's nice to see both Engine Summer and In Watermelon Sugar on this list. If you like mellow postapocalpyse, check out Hitoshi Ashinano's manga Yokohama Kaidashi Kikou.
- retrocryptid 3y ago
  Hmm. Just thinking about west meeting east... Hiroshima Mon Amour is, in many ways, a cyberpunk work in the way the concept of memory as a first-class character with its own life is in clear display.
corethree 3y ago
15. Rocannon’s World has a stupid tagline in the title. Ignore it. This book is short and is supposed to be the first part of a novella called "worlds of exile and illusion" which consists of a trilogy of stories. Read the novella of 3 stories in order. Do not just read rocanonns world individually. When read Separately the stories are your standard sci Fi fare but when wholistically read the trilogy becomes one of the most epic stories I have ever read. All three stories seem only slightly connected but as a trilogy all three stories combine to form a completely different epic tale that spans the entire universe. I didn't really like Ursula's left hand of darkness. It was ok, but worlds of exile and illusion blew me away. But for some reason most people don't know about this gem and I think it's because the books were initially released separately. The whole thing needs to be read in order as one book, the length of each story actually makes it better fit for a single book too, link: Worlds of Exile and Illusion (Hainish) https://a.co/d/0jtS7Zb https://a.co/d/0jtS7Zb Guaranteed there's nothing else like it in sci Fi both on television and in other sci Fi books.
- zem 3y ago
  I read the entire hainish cycle back to back in chronological order once, and it was a superb experience. the books aren't technically a series but they do build up a coherent universe and timeline between them.
  - corethree 3y ago
    I would say the first three books form a series. An underlying story of a great interstellar war and how that war was first lost than won. Of course you won't be able to put all of this together until the last book in the trilogy, the last chapter. The other books can be read out of order, but the first three are a trilogy.
thriftwy 3y ago
There's no Mote In God's Eye... It seems to match the time frame and it's one of the best books known to me.
- aardvark179 3y ago
  It is also very definitely not new wave.
  - thriftwy 3y ago
    It is a very advanced book from literary standpoint. The new wave is now an "old" wave with all the weird stuff, but Niven would read as fresh today as back in the 70s.
ur-whale 3y ago
No mention of any piece by Jack Vance ? For something to claim to cover the golden age of Sci-Fi ? Very weird.
- andybak 3y ago
  New Wave has a specific meaning and it's one that by definition excludes another specific period ("Golden Age") I'm not quite sure whether Jack Vance is regarded as part of either? EDIT - ah - further down the page there's a mention of Golden Age. But it seems to only be in terms of precursors and influences on New Wave: > The following titles from science fiction’s so-called Golden Age (1934–1963) are listed here in order to provide historical context.
  - deng 3y ago
    Yes, this is not a list of "Best SciFi books from 1964 to 1983", it is specifically meant to cover the subgenre of New Wave. This is also why for instance "Flowers for Algernon" or "The forever war" is not there, since they are not considered New Wave but are for sure classics that would be on a generic "Best SciFi" list.
root_axis 3y ago
Needs more Gene Wolfe :)
- bouvin 3y ago
  Any SF list is incomplete without him! However, he was never New Wave, which this list is.
  - aardvark179 3y ago
    But it does include The Fifth Head of Cerberus. I think only work up to Book of the New Sun would fall into the specified time period, so most of his work would qualify even if it were new wave.
  - Finnucane 3y ago
    A lot of his early short stories were pretty new wavish. He did, after all claim that Damon Knight grew him from a bean.
AceJohnny2 3y ago
Related, someone on Reddit re-read all the Hugo/Nebula/Locus/WFA winning books and reviewed them. I found their rating system, and how well the books aged, very worthwhile: https://www.reddit.com/user/RabidFoxz/comments/stwi8k/vol_6_of_book_reviews_back_in_action/ https://www.reddit.com/user/RabidFoxz/comments/stwi8k/vol_6_...
- retrocryptid 3y ago
  Good list, but Orson Scott Card is a bit over-represnted. I recently re-read scheismatrix (plus) after 35 years. My spouse found a copy of Burning Chrome in the local tiny library, so I'm likely to review a few more cyberpunk works. I have fond memories of the 64-83 era, but it took me a while to warm to Sterling and Gibson. It almost seems like every new sci-fi story has a bit of cyberpunk embedded in it. All the cyberpunk authors were (I believe) influenced by Ballard and PKD. Anyway. Thx for the pointer.
  - justsomehnguy 3y ago
    › found a copy of Burning Chrome most of Gibson's works I had read in ncview.exe I doubt I can replicate the experience now *sad smile*
    - drdaeman 3y ago
      There are a bunch of terminal apps that emulate CRT look-and-feel, and you can surely run NC in an emulator.
      - justsomehnguy 3y ago
        Sure, but I wans't talking about the visuals alone. I can run NC in DosBox on the glorious 43". I read Gibson on 15" in the native 320x200 and my 40Mb HDD shook the table table on the seeks.
        squarefoot 3y ago
retrocryptid 3y ago
Man. Someone really likes PKD. And sure, his stories are great reality-benders. Maybe we could use a little bit more of that these days. And I love Ballard. I think PKD is slightly over-represented on this list and Ursula K Leguin slightly under-represented. But I'm happy to see some of the other authors made the cut. I think if I were to do a list like this I would pick 10 or 12 authors from the era and mention which works express the literary zeitgeist. Dang. Maybe I SHOULD do that.
- norir 3y ago
  It is wild that PKD and UKLG both went to Berkeley HS at the same time (though UKLG has said that neither she nor any of her friends had any memory of him).
danidiaz 3y ago
I would also recommend the site "Science Fiction Ruminations": https://sciencefictionruminations.com/ https://sciencefictionruminations.com/ Lots of thoughtful sf book reviews with a heavy (but not exclusive) focus on the New Wave.
deng 3y ago
Good list, though of course I have only read maybe half, if even. A bit too heavy on Dick and Ballard for my taste, but I'm very happy to see James Tiptree Jr. (Alice Sheldon) and Octavia Butler on there, which are too often forgotten
- DougMerritt 3y ago
  James Tiptree Jr (yes, aka Alice Sheldon) is often forgotten? That would be criminal!
everyone 3y ago
I appreciate any list of sci-fi books, and it's interesting to see, but for me, this list sucks. It's very fantasy / literature heavy as opposed to hard sci-fi. Seems like a list of "sci-fi" books from someone who doesnt really like sci-fi. For me it's like a bottom 75 list.
- deng 3y ago
  It says "New Wave SciFi" in the title, so it only covers "New Wave Scifi". It's perfectly fine to not like the genre, of course, but that's not a fault of this list.
- bouvin 3y ago
  'Bottom 75 list'? You have not read much SF, have you? Sturgeon's Law [1] was created for a reason. If you think this is as bad as SF gets, I turn your attention to Robert A. Heinlein's "To Sail Beyond the Sunset". [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sturgeon's_law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sturgeon's_law
- tuatoru 3y ago
  If you don't like any of these, you don't like science fiction. As Fred Pohl said, "the task of the science fiction writer is not to imagine the automobile but the traffic jam". Perhaps you prefer "cowboys in space", like Star Trek, Star Wars, Terminator, or Firefly.
  - everyone 3y ago
    I love sc-fi. It's by far my favourite type of novel to read. In fact I usually read either non fiction (popular science, reportage) or sci-fi. I have read probably a couple hundred sci-fi books, including many on that list. I have read a lot in order to find the really good stuff which is quite rare imo. My favorite sci-fi authors are Arthur C. Clarke and Greg Egan. I also like Kim Stanley Robinson, Charles Stross, Robert L Forward, Andy Weir, Stephen Baxter. The stuff you mentioned are movies / tv firstly and secondly I wouldnt even personally classify them as sci-fi, they are more pure fantasy. Just for example, Greg Egan's written some of the most far-out sci-fi Ive ever read, eg. Dichronauts describing life in a universe with different geometry to our own + symbiotic intelligent lifeforms that can each percieve space on different axes. https://www.gregegan.net/DICHRONAUTS/DICHRONAUTS.html https://www.gregegan.net/DICHRONAUTS/DICHRONAUTS.html
gcanyon 3y ago
Making my pitch for John Varley's work. The Eight Worlds setup is rich, interesting, and mind-expanding.
- ryantgtg 3y ago
  And it’s still going! It was refreshing to have a new book set in that world. I’m a big fan, and think a few more of his books should have been on this list.
  - gcanyon 3y ago
    Wait -- is there something more recent than Irontown Blues?
    - ryantgtg 3y ago
      OK time flies. That felt like two years ago to me.
  - gcanyon 3y ago
    Humble brag, but I started the wikipedia page on Varley. (I wasn't logged in at the time, but that was my IP address!) And I owe it all to my sister, who gave me Wizard -- not Titan :-) -- for Christmas one year.
    - ryantgtg 3y ago
      I owe it all to an English teacher in college who photocopied Equinoctial for us (this was about 1998). I loved it, and quickly proceeded to devour his novels.
deng 3y ago
It seems a lot of people here are unaware that "New Wave Science Fiction" is not another name for this specific time period but rather a subgenre of SciFi which started and got popular during that period. See also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Wave_science_fiction https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Wave_science_fiction Of course very good other SciFi was written during that period as well.
worik 3y ago
I am unconvinced Phillip K Dick wrote some absolute classics. And some utter dross. In this period I do think there is a rough arc of transition, but I disagree that there are definable ages It is good sport of arbitrary classification but has no useful meaning in selecting books Ax a counter example there is TV, where technology defined clear boundaries cable then streaming Nothing, not even kindle, has hat such an effect in literature. It is gradual change from the 1940s through the twenty first century. 1940 very different from 2023, but no boundaries
Finnucane 3y ago
No R. A. Lafferty or David R. Bunch. Maybe that’s too far outside the lines for this guy.
tuatoru 3y ago
Stand On Zanzibar is only number 19? No Report On Probability A? Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man. Good to see many old favourites though.
jacquesm 3y ago
To save you some scripting: Alan Moore - dystopian graphic novel V for Vendetta (serialized 1982–1989) Alejandro Jodorowsky Jean Giraud (Moebius) - graphic novel The Incal (1980–1988) Anna Kavan - Ice (1967). Anne McCaffrey - The Ship Who Sang (1969) Arkady and Boris Strugatsky - Пикник на обочине (1972; Piknik na obochine; translated as A Roadside Picnic) Barry N. Malzberg - Beyond Apollo (1972) Brian Aldiss - Barefoot in the Head (1969) Brian Aldiss - Greybeard (1964). Chester Anderson - The Butterfly Kid (1967) Christopher Priest - Inverted World (1974) Cordwainer Smith - Norstrilia (1975, in complete form). David Bowie - The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars (1972) Frank Herbert - Dune (1965) Frank Miller - graphic novel Rōnin (1983–1984) Gary Panter - comic Jimbo (serialized 1977–present) Gary Panter - comic strip Dal Tokyo (1983–2007) Gene Wolfe - The Fifth Head of Cerberus (1972) Harlan Ellison’s (ed.) Dangerous Visions (1967) Jack Kirby - Fourth World comics (1971–1974). Jack Kirby - pre-Fourth World sci-fi comics (1964–1970) James Tiptree Jr. - Up the Walls of the World (1978) Jane Gaskell - A Sweet, Sweet Summer (1969) J.G. Ballard - Crash (1973) J.G. Ballard - High-Rise (1975) J.G. Ballard - The Atrocity Exhibition (written 1967, published 1970) J.G. Ballard - The Burning World (1964) J.G. Ballard - The Crystal World (1966) Joanna Russ - We Who Are About To… (serialized 1976; in book form, 1977) John Brunner - Stand on Zanzibar (1968). John Brunner - The Sheep Look Up (1972) John Crowley - Engine Summer (1979) John Crowley - The Deep (1975). John Sladek - Roderick at Random (1983) John Sladek’s - The Müller-Fokker Effect (1970) John Varley - The Ophiuchi Hotline (1977) John Wagner, Alan Grant, and Carlos Ezquerra - Judge Dredd adventures Block Mania (serialized 10/31/1981 to 12/26/81) and The Apocalypse War (1/2/82 to 6/26/82). Josephine Saxton - The Hieros Gamos of Sam and An Smith (1969) Katsuhiro Otomo - manga series Akira (1982–1990) Kurt Vonnegut - Slaughterhouse-Five, or The Children's Crusade: A Duty-Dance with Death (1969) Michael Moorcock - The English Assassin (1972) M. John Harrison - The Pastel City (1971) Moebius-s Le Garage Hermétique (The Airtight Garage, 1976–1979) Octavia E. Butler-s Kindred (1979) Octavia E. Butler - Wild Seed (1980) Philip K. Dick - A Maze of Death (1970) Philip K. Dick - A Scanner Darkly (1977) Philip K. Dick - Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep? (1968) Philip K. Dick - Flow My Tears, the Policeman Said (1974). Philip K. Dick - Martian Time-Slip (1964) Philip K. Dick - Now Wait for Last Year (1966) Philip K. Dick - The Three Stigmata of Palmer Eldritch (1965) Philip K. Dick - The Unteleported Man (1966) Philip K. Dick - Ubik (1969). Philip K. Dick - VALIS (1981) Richard Brautigan - In Watermelon Sugar (1968). Robert Heinlein - Friday (1982). Robert Silverberg - Dying Inside (1972) Roger Zelazny - Lord of Light (1967) Russell Hoban - Riddley Walker (1980) Samuel R. Delany - Babel-17 (1966). Samuel R. Delany - Dhalgren (1975) Samuel R. Delany - Nova (1968) Samuel R. Delany - The Einstein Intersection (1967) Samuel R. Delany - Trouble on Triton: An Ambiguous Heterotopia (1976) Stanislaw Lem - Ze wspomnien Ijona Tichego Kongres futurologiczny (The Futurological Congress, 1971) Thomas M. Disch - Camp Concentration (1968) Thomas Pynchon - Gravity’s Rainbow (1973) Ursula K. Le Guin - Rocannon's World (1966) Ursula K. Le Guin - The Dispossessed (1974). Ursula K. LeGuin - The Lathe of Heaven (1971) Ursula K. Le Guin - The Left Hand of Darkness (1969) Vladimir Nabokov - Ada, or Ardor (1969) Vonda N. McIntyre - Dreamsnake (1978) Walker Percy - Love in the Ruins (1971) William Burroughs - Nova Express (1964)

163 points by webmaven 3y ago

Hugged to death already https://web.archive.org/web/20231109133450/https://www.hilobrow.com/new-wave-sci-fi/ https://web.archive.org/web/20231109133450/https://www.hilob...

daoboy 3y ago

It is interesting to see how a handful of writers (especially Phillip K Dick!) really dominated the genre. Also a few forgotten gems I am going to have to reread now.

kramerger 3y ago
I feel this was the winter of sci-fi. I enjoyed Dune and Androids but the rest are mostly meh. A lot of DNF books for me (including Slaughterhouse-Five, which I know has its fans but I really disliked)
- aardvark179 3y ago
  I couldn’t disagree more. The new wave is where SF starts to get interesting for me, and is when a lot of my favourite authors got started.
- sctb 3y ago
  I'm curious to hear more about why you feel this was the winter of sci-fi! Can you share some more besides personal preference? (I'm not a huge Vonnegut fan or even big reader in general and Slaughterhouse-Five and Cat's Cradle were pretty far from DNF for me.)
- ajmurmann 3y ago
  I feel similarly. However, I absolutely love Vonnegut, but don't see his work as scifi. Sure it has all the elements, but the themes are mostly different. To me the best scifi is about a technology that could exist and plays through all the consequences. Slaughterhouse Five isn't that, it's about WWII. (From my definition one might guess correctly that I see space opera as a derogatory term)
  - kramerger 3y ago
    I heard that his writing could have been a way to process what he went through during the war. That could explain the darkness. There is a modern fantasy writer that writes quite dark stories. I read that this is because of a very sick family member, and some of his best books have been written in a hospital room. While I applaude both for turning something bad into something good, these sort of books are just not my cup of tea. And I think a lot of people are like me. We read books to get away from the problems of real life, not dive into other people's troubled minds.
    - ajmurmann 3y ago
      "And I think a lot of people are like me. We read books to get away from the problems of real life, not dive into other people's troubled minds." That certainly makes sense and is of course also a subjective preference. To me great insights lie in the darkness, but it isn't for everyone and not at any time.
PaulHoule 3y ago
I like the list. It's the kind of list an English professor might make, not necessarily a sci-fi fan. In particular, Dick's genius was recognized only after his death. Even though sci-fi sometimes rises above other genre literature, it's not taken that seriously by literary types. Baudrillard talks a lot about Dick and Ballard and that's it. Stanislaw Lem (whose Cyberiad ought to be on that list instead of The Futurological Congress) himself said that Phillip K. Dick was on a whole other level than other sci-fi writers. Notably the list subverts the category of "novel" by adding a lot of things (comic books, concept albums) that aren't really novels. I think Fred Pohl is missing (say Gateway) and also Joe Halderman (Worlds!). I'd rather see any Frank Herbert book but Dune (say Whipping Star or The Santaroga Barrier.) For that matter I'd like to see something from Heinlein before he had the stroke like The Moon is a Harsh Mistress or Glory Road. I'd also want to see Niven's Neutron Star (a set of short stories that read like a novel) but despite some "new wave" sensibilities Niven comes across as reactionary today because the Tor Books revival (Forge of God and Enders Game) of sci-fi in the 1980s liked Heinlein and Niven and Doc Smith better than LeGunn, Dick, Ballard, Herbert, etc. On the other hand, put a sci-fi fan in charge of making this list and it's no doubt they'll add a stick of books from some author who is a "no account" in literary circles like Piers Anthony -- still I would try to slip him in at his most psychedelic.
- routerl 3y ago
  > Dick's genius was recognized only after his death. Which we should give credit for: I only found PKD due to Jonathan Lethem's advocacy. PKD fans are likely to enjoy Lethem's sci-fi, especially Gun, With Occasional Music. The crew of writers responsible for elevating PKD from pulp to cult deserve some attention, especially from PKD fans (aka "Dick-heads", which is just the most perfect name for a fandom). > I'd like to see something from Heinlein before he had the stroke like The Moon is a Harsh Mistress Plus one for The Moon is a Harsh Mistress. That's probably the best of Heinlein's work.
  - getwiththeprog 3y ago
    Very rarely can I say with all sincerity "I am a Dick-Head"
mbb70 3y ago
Pkd was a genius, an addict, and most importantly, got paid by the page. Jonathan Letham's Amnesia Moon (mentioned at the bottom) is my favorite "how pkd would write if he weren't ripped on speed 24/7" Guess it's time to reread it. And ubik, and fmytps, and the lathe of heaven, and hyperion, and embassytown and...
- sonofhans 3y ago
  If you haven’t, check out “Philip K Dick is Dead, Alas,” by Micheal Bishop. Same vibes — Dick without the speed :)

vodou 3y ago

I really love this era of sci-fi, a kind of short window between the immature boy fantasies before and the dull hard SF the came after. The weirdness, the hallucinatory, the craziness! And most importantly, so many great writers.

windowshopping 3y ago
Enders game, speaker for the dead, ringworld, and many others are post-1983. Are those dull hard sci fi?
- demondemidi 3y ago
  "Ender's Game" is a little boy fantasy, almost literally.
- ur-whale 3y ago
  > Enders game, speaker for the dead Truly not in the same category as stuff from e.g. PKD, by a very wide margin, especially speaker for the dead.
  - windowshopping 3y ago
    Well, matter of opinion, and judging by critics' lists your opinion is the minority.
- zem 3y ago
  not to mention the vorkosigan series!
ur-whale 3y ago
> the dull hard SF the came after To be fair to the crowd that came after, the average consumption of creativity-enhancing substances was a lot less in the 80's and forward than in the [60's, early 80's] period.
andybak 3y ago
Doesn't Hard SF both predate and postdate New Wave? It's a thread that weaves through the whole of science-fiction. (heck - didn't Jules Verne once diss H.G. Wells for not being "hard sci-fi enough"?)

demondemidi 3y ago

It's really hard to overstate the impact of PKD's later works and JG Ballard. Having read about 50% of this list, I think all of our modern dystopia, paranoia, and existential SciFi sprouted from their insane seeds. And the depth of LeGuin's exploration of social, sexual, and economic identity in alien worlds sticks out like a sore thumb compared to her peers. Damn, tho, the book cover for The Three Stigmata... is fascinating. I always pictured him as just a cyborg octogenarian but now I can't unsee this. I miss that artwork. Aaaaand, it would be nice of the page author would put these in a CSV at the bottom so that I can make a checklist!

PaulDavisThe1st 3y ago
I don't know enough to know if your ascription of those "ills" to those authors is accurate, but I certainly find it refreshing to see someone asserting that no, it's not "just fiction" and the art we create and consume changes us, and changes society, not always in a good way.
- retrocryptid 3y ago
  I've often thought that if the American libertarian party renamed themselves "The LeGuin Party" they might get a lot more members.
  - runeofdoom 3y ago
    Such members would be unlikely to support their "I've got mine, fuck you" ideology.
    - darthrupert 3y ago
      You're thinking of communists, establishment conservatists and wealthy progressives. Libertarians are the opposite of that.
      - deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]

ranprieur 3y ago

It's nice to see both Engine Summer and In Watermelon Sugar on this list. If you like mellow postapocalpyse, check out Hitoshi Ashinano's manga Yokohama Kaidashi Kikou.

retrocryptid 3y ago
Hmm. Just thinking about west meeting east... Hiroshima Mon Amour is, in many ways, a cyberpunk work in the way the concept of memory as a first-class character with its own life is in clear display.

corethree 3y ago

15. Rocannon’s World has a stupid tagline in the title. Ignore it. This book is short and is supposed to be the first part of a novella called "worlds of exile and illusion" which consists of a trilogy of stories. Read the novella of 3 stories in order. Do not just read rocanonns world individually. When read Separately the stories are your standard sci Fi fare but when wholistically read the trilogy becomes one of the most epic stories I have ever read. All three stories seem only slightly connected but as a trilogy all three stories combine to form a completely different epic tale that spans the entire universe. I didn't really like Ursula's left hand of darkness. It was ok, but worlds of exile and illusion blew me away. But for some reason most people don't know about this gem and I think it's because the books were initially released separately. The whole thing needs to be read in order as one book, the length of each story actually makes it better fit for a single book too, link: Worlds of Exile and Illusion (Hainish) https://a.co/d/0jtS7Zb https://a.co/d/0jtS7Zb Guaranteed there's nothing else like it in sci Fi both on television and in other sci Fi books.

zem 3y ago
I read the entire hainish cycle back to back in chronological order once, and it was a superb experience. the books aren't technically a series but they do build up a coherent universe and timeline between them.
- corethree 3y ago
  I would say the first three books form a series. An underlying story of a great interstellar war and how that war was first lost than won. Of course you won't be able to put all of this together until the last book in the trilogy, the last chapter. The other books can be read out of order, but the first three are a trilogy.

thriftwy 3y ago

There's no Mote In God's Eye... It seems to match the time frame and it's one of the best books known to me.

aardvark179 3y ago
It is also very definitely not new wave.
- thriftwy 3y ago
  It is a very advanced book from literary standpoint. The new wave is now an "old" wave with all the weird stuff, but Niven would read as fresh today as back in the 70s.

ur-whale 3y ago

No mention of any piece by Jack Vance ? For something to claim to cover the golden age of Sci-Fi ? Very weird.

andybak 3y ago
New Wave has a specific meaning and it's one that by definition excludes another specific period ("Golden Age") I'm not quite sure whether Jack Vance is regarded as part of either? EDIT - ah - further down the page there's a mention of Golden Age. But it seems to only be in terms of precursors and influences on New Wave: > The following titles from science fiction’s so-called Golden Age (1934–1963) are listed here in order to provide historical context.
- deng 3y ago
  Yes, this is not a list of "Best SciFi books from 1964 to 1983", it is specifically meant to cover the subgenre of New Wave. This is also why for instance "Flowers for Algernon" or "The forever war" is not there, since they are not considered New Wave but are for sure classics that would be on a generic "Best SciFi" list.

root_axis 3y ago

Needs more Gene Wolfe :)

bouvin 3y ago
Any SF list is incomplete without him! However, he was never New Wave, which this list is.
- aardvark179 3y ago
  But it does include The Fifth Head of Cerberus. I think only work up to Book of the New Sun would fall into the specified time period, so most of his work would qualify even if it were new wave.
- Finnucane 3y ago
  A lot of his early short stories were pretty new wavish. He did, after all claim that Damon Knight grew him from a bean.

AceJohnny2 3y ago

Related, someone on Reddit re-read all the Hugo/Nebula/Locus/WFA winning books and reviewed them. I found their rating system, and how well the books aged, very worthwhile: https://www.reddit.com/user/RabidFoxz/comments/stwi8k/vol_6_of_book_reviews_back_in_action/ https://www.reddit.com/user/RabidFoxz/comments/stwi8k/vol_6_...

retrocryptid 3y ago
Good list, but Orson Scott Card is a bit over-represnted. I recently re-read scheismatrix (plus) after 35 years. My spouse found a copy of Burning Chrome in the local tiny library, so I'm likely to review a few more cyberpunk works. I have fond memories of the 64-83 era, but it took me a while to warm to Sterling and Gibson. It almost seems like every new sci-fi story has a bit of cyberpunk embedded in it. All the cyberpunk authors were (I believe) influenced by Ballard and PKD. Anyway. Thx for the pointer.
- justsomehnguy 3y ago
  › found a copy of Burning Chrome most of Gibson's works I had read in ncview.exe I doubt I can replicate the experience now *sad smile*
  - drdaeman 3y ago
    There are a bunch of terminal apps that emulate CRT look-and-feel, and you can surely run NC in an emulator.
    - justsomehnguy 3y ago
      Sure, but I wans't talking about the visuals alone. I can run NC in DosBox on the glorious 43". I read Gibson on 15" in the native 320x200 and my 40Mb HDD shook the table table on the seeks.
      - squarefoot 3y ago

retrocryptid 3y ago

Man. Someone really likes PKD. And sure, his stories are great reality-benders. Maybe we could use a little bit more of that these days. And I love Ballard. I think PKD is slightly over-represented on this list and Ursula K Leguin slightly under-represented. But I'm happy to see some of the other authors made the cut. I think if I were to do a list like this I would pick 10 or 12 authors from the era and mention which works express the literary zeitgeist. Dang. Maybe I SHOULD do that.

norir 3y ago
It is wild that PKD and UKLG both went to Berkeley HS at the same time (though UKLG has said that neither she nor any of her friends had any memory of him).

danidiaz 3y ago

I would also recommend the site "Science Fiction Ruminations": https://sciencefictionruminations.com/ https://sciencefictionruminations.com/ Lots of thoughtful sf book reviews with a heavy (but not exclusive) focus on the New Wave.

deng 3y ago

Good list, though of course I have only read maybe half, if even. A bit too heavy on Dick and Ballard for my taste, but I'm very happy to see James Tiptree Jr. (Alice Sheldon) and Octavia Butler on there, which are too often forgotten

DougMerritt 3y ago
James Tiptree Jr (yes, aka Alice Sheldon) is often forgotten? That would be criminal!

everyone 3y ago

I appreciate any list of sci-fi books, and it's interesting to see, but for me, this list sucks. It's very fantasy / literature heavy as opposed to hard sci-fi. Seems like a list of "sci-fi" books from someone who doesnt really like sci-fi. For me it's like a bottom 75 list.

deng 3y ago
It says "New Wave SciFi" in the title, so it only covers "New Wave Scifi". It's perfectly fine to not like the genre, of course, but that's not a fault of this list.
bouvin 3y ago
'Bottom 75 list'? You have not read much SF, have you? Sturgeon's Law [1] was created for a reason. If you think this is as bad as SF gets, I turn your attention to Robert A. Heinlein's "To Sail Beyond the Sunset". [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sturgeon's_law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sturgeon's_law
tuatoru 3y ago
If you don't like any of these, you don't like science fiction. As Fred Pohl said, "the task of the science fiction writer is not to imagine the automobile but the traffic jam". Perhaps you prefer "cowboys in space", like Star Trek, Star Wars, Terminator, or Firefly.
- everyone 3y ago
  I love sc-fi. It's by far my favourite type of novel to read. In fact I usually read either non fiction (popular science, reportage) or sci-fi. I have read probably a couple hundred sci-fi books, including many on that list. I have read a lot in order to find the really good stuff which is quite rare imo. My favorite sci-fi authors are Arthur C. Clarke and Greg Egan. I also like Kim Stanley Robinson, Charles Stross, Robert L Forward, Andy Weir, Stephen Baxter. The stuff you mentioned are movies / tv firstly and secondly I wouldnt even personally classify them as sci-fi, they are more pure fantasy. Just for example, Greg Egan's written some of the most far-out sci-fi Ive ever read, eg. Dichronauts describing life in a universe with different geometry to our own + symbiotic intelligent lifeforms that can each percieve space on different axes. https://www.gregegan.net/DICHRONAUTS/DICHRONAUTS.html https://www.gregegan.net/DICHRONAUTS/DICHRONAUTS.html

gcanyon 3y ago

Making my pitch for John Varley's work. The Eight Worlds setup is rich, interesting, and mind-expanding.

ryantgtg 3y ago
And it’s still going! It was refreshing to have a new book set in that world. I’m a big fan, and think a few more of his books should have been on this list.
- gcanyon 3y ago
  Wait -- is there something more recent than Irontown Blues?
  - ryantgtg 3y ago
    OK time flies. That felt like two years ago to me.
- gcanyon 3y ago
  Humble brag, but I started the wikipedia page on Varley. (I wasn't logged in at the time, but that was my IP address!) And I owe it all to my sister, who gave me Wizard -- not Titan :-) -- for Christmas one year.
  - ryantgtg 3y ago
    I owe it all to an English teacher in college who photocopied Equinoctial for us (this was about 1998). I loved it, and quickly proceeded to devour his novels.

deng 3y ago

It seems a lot of people here are unaware that "New Wave Science Fiction" is not another name for this specific time period but rather a subgenre of SciFi which started and got popular during that period. See also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Wave_science_fiction https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Wave_science_fiction Of course very good other SciFi was written during that period as well.

worik 3y ago

I am unconvinced Phillip K Dick wrote some absolute classics. And some utter dross. In this period I do think there is a rough arc of transition, but I disagree that there are definable ages It is good sport of arbitrary classification but has no useful meaning in selecting books Ax a counter example there is TV, where technology defined clear boundaries cable then streaming Nothing, not even kindle, has hat such an effect in literature. It is gradual change from the 1940s through the twenty first century. 1940 very different from 2023, but no boundaries

Finnucane 3y ago

No R. A. Lafferty or David R. Bunch. Maybe that’s too far outside the lines for this guy.

tuatoru 3y ago

Stand On Zanzibar is only number 19? No Report On Probability A? Well, that's just, like, your opinion, man. Good to see many old favourites though.

jacquesm 3y ago

To save you some scripting: Alan Moore - dystopian graphic novel V for Vendetta (serialized 1982–1989) Alejandro Jodorowsky Jean Giraud (Moebius) - graphic novel The Incal (1980–1988) Anna Kavan - Ice (1967). Anne McCaffrey - The Ship Who Sang (1969) Arkady and Boris Strugatsky - Пикник на обочине (1972; Piknik na obochine; translated as A Roadside Picnic) Barry N. Malzberg - Beyond Apollo (1972) Brian Aldiss - Barefoot in the Head (1969) Brian Aldiss - Greybeard (1964). Chester Anderson - The Butterfly Kid (1967) Christopher Priest - Inverted World (1974) Cordwainer Smith - Norstrilia (1975, in complete form). David Bowie - The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars (1972) Frank Herbert - Dune (1965) Frank Miller - graphic novel Rōnin (1983–1984) Gary Panter - comic Jimbo (serialized 1977–present) Gary Panter - comic strip Dal Tokyo (1983–2007) Gene Wolfe - The Fifth Head of Cerberus (1972) Harlan Ellison’s (ed.) Dangerous Visions (1967) Jack Kirby - Fourth World comics (1971–1974). Jack Kirby - pre-Fourth World sci-fi comics (1964–1970) James Tiptree Jr. - Up the Walls of the World (1978) Jane Gaskell - A Sweet, Sweet Summer (1969) J.G. Ballard - Crash (1973) J.G. Ballard - High-Rise (1975) J.G. Ballard - The Atrocity Exhibition (written 1967, published 1970) J.G. Ballard - The Burning World (1964) J.G. Ballard - The Crystal World (1966) Joanna Russ - We Who Are About To… (serialized 1976; in book form, 1977) John Brunner - Stand on Zanzibar (1968). John Brunner - The Sheep Look Up (1972) John Crowley - Engine Summer (1979) John Crowley - The Deep (1975). John Sladek - Roderick at Random (1983) John Sladek’s - The Müller-Fokker Effect (1970) John Varley - The Ophiuchi Hotline (1977) John Wagner, Alan Grant, and Carlos Ezquerra - Judge Dredd adventures Block Mania (serialized 10/31/1981 to 12/26/81) and The Apocalypse War (1/2/82 to 6/26/82). Josephine Saxton - The Hieros Gamos of Sam and An Smith (1969) Katsuhiro Otomo - manga series Akira (1982–1990) Kurt Vonnegut - Slaughterhouse-Five, or The Children's Crusade: A Duty-Dance with Death (1969) Michael Moorcock - The English Assassin (1972) M. John Harrison - The Pastel City (1971) Moebius-s Le Garage Hermétique (The Airtight Garage, 1976–1979) Octavia E. Butler-s Kindred (1979) Octavia E. Butler - Wild Seed (1980) Philip K. Dick - A Maze of Death (1970) Philip K. Dick - A Scanner Darkly (1977) Philip K. Dick - Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep? (1968) Philip K. Dick - Flow My Tears, the Policeman Said (1974). Philip K. Dick - Martian Time-Slip (1964) Philip K. Dick - Now Wait for Last Year (1966) Philip K. Dick - The Three Stigmata of Palmer Eldritch (1965) Philip K. Dick - The Unteleported Man (1966) Philip K. Dick - Ubik (1969). Philip K. Dick - VALIS (1981) Richard Brautigan - In Watermelon Sugar (1968). Robert Heinlein - Friday (1982). Robert Silverberg - Dying Inside (1972) Roger Zelazny - Lord of Light (1967) Russell Hoban - Riddley Walker (1980) Samuel R. Delany - Babel-17 (1966). Samuel R. Delany - Dhalgren (1975) Samuel R. Delany - Nova (1968) Samuel R. Delany - The Einstein Intersection (1967) Samuel R. Delany - Trouble on Triton: An Ambiguous Heterotopia (1976) Stanislaw Lem - Ze wspomnien Ijona Tichego Kongres futurologiczny (The Futurological Congress, 1971) Thomas M. Disch - Camp Concentration (1968) Thomas Pynchon - Gravity’s Rainbow (1973) Ursula K. Le Guin - Rocannon's World (1966) Ursula K. Le Guin - The Dispossessed (1974). Ursula K. LeGuin - The Lathe of Heaven (1971) Ursula K. Le Guin - The Left Hand of Darkness (1969) Vladimir Nabokov - Ada, or Ardor (1969) Vonda N. McIntyre - Dreamsnake (1978) Walker Percy - Love in the Ruins (1971) William Burroughs - Nova Express (1964)