5 ms·

I don't know how credible I am (fwiw white British, Christened but agnostic, no particular bias except perhaps 'hey guys can't you resolve this peacefully someh

by OJFord 3y ago

I don't know how credible I am (fwiw white British, Christened but agnostic, no particular bias except perhaps 'hey guys can't you resolve this peacefully somehow') and it's difficult for me to understand much, but I think he's not being that direct about it, but kind of alluding to it, talking a bit euphemistically. In the beginning after saying 'we are urging Sikhs not to fly Air India' in English, which sounds like boycott, he switches to Hindi[0] and says similar with 'on the 19th November' (unnis navambar ko) - why would a boycott be so specific; then he says same date 'Indira Gandhi airport [Delhi international, i.e. North India but not Punjab] will be closed' (band rahega). Later he says something about 'khalistani airport' which I would guess is his way of referring to Amritsar or Chandigarh (the two international airports in Punjab afaict, perhaps the former because it's cleanly Punjab vs. the latter seems to be the capital city of both Punjab and Haryana states, kind of an interesting quirk) but it's difficult for me to understand much more. Edit: actually it's Chandigarh, I just realised the sentence is 'Shaheed Bhagat Singh [name of Chandigarh airport] will be the khalistani airport' (khalistani airport hoega). Again you could say it's a boycott: take your money to Punjab's airports, not Delhi's - but why's the latter 'closed', why 19 November specifically. As an economic boycott, that being done by the subset of Sikhs who follow him on a single day would have trivial impact, it'd be completely inconsequential. I realise that's not much, maybe it helps a bit, I was mainly interested for myself as a learning exercise really! (My vocabulary's quite limited, but more than that I struggle just with listening/speaking fast enough, so trying to practice more in ways other than reading.) [0] or maybe Punjabi, I'd have thought it would be, and they're similar enough spoken that I'd pick bits up anyway, but seems more familiar (i.e. Hindi) word endings/conjugations to me (even where I don't know the actual word) than there would be if it was Punjabi (which I might recognise from '-da's and '-di's for example)

dragonwriter 3y ago
> he switches to Hindi and says similar with 'on the 19th November' (unnis navambar ko) - why would a boycott be so specific Specific date and limited specific location boycotts are a frequently done because they are easier to motivate people for the amount of symbolic impact (because people can rearrange purchases rather than actually cancel them), and because they can prime people for a longer or more general boycott. Its not an uncommon strategy. (People do argue against it because the impacts are largely symbolic, for the same reasons it is easier to organize, and because there is an argument that they can lead to exhaustion -- "I've done the one thing and now you want more" -- more than priming. So there is controversy in the kinds of groups that call for boycotts about them, but, they are still a thing that is done, not an unplausible boycott technique that makes "threat" the only plausible interpretation.)
JumpCrisscross 3y ago
Thank you. Seriously. Do you, in your reading, see a threat? Because I’m not. (Certainly not “that Indira Gandhi Airport will be attacked on November 19th.”) I think it’s dramatically framed to generate clicks. But a lot of right-wing gun crap also sounds like that, and I don’t think they’re always making credible threats. [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dr-gridlock/wp/2017/01/29/uber-triggers-protest-for-not-supporting-taxi-strike-against-refugee-ban/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dr-gridlock/wp/2017/01/2...
- OJFord 3y ago
  Honestly I don't understand enough to be that confident about it. Maybe I'm naive and too trusting, but personally I took the news org (youth-run or not) sharing it - who presumably do understand it - at face value. I think it's fair to say it's a relatively violent movement - the Wikipedia entry has a section on 'militancy' but not 'peaceful protests' or 'boycotts' for example - but it's not one thing, it's an idea or collection of ideas and there are various groups and factions, so I really don't know anywhere near enough about it - you'd have to take this video in the context of what else this particular guy's said about his own views, rather than what others have done to the same end - in the name of 'khalistan' - really.
- sher_e_punjab 3y ago
  No his translation is only partial considering he is not a Punjabi. Pannun clearly says "Sikh panthalayo unni november ko baad Air India me safar ni karna. Jaanu khatra ho sagda hai". You can match the timeline in the video from 0:16 to 0:22. Translates to: "Sikh people (panth) don't travel in Air India after 19th November. There will be a threat to your life (Jaanu = Life, khatra = Threat, ho sagda hai = possibility of a threat)" Who will threaten Sikh lives in Air India after 19th November? It is literally reminder of Air India Flight 182 bombings.
  - OJFord 3y ago
    Oh so it is Punjabi, I didn't pick up on that sagda (vs. Hindi would be sakta) for example. (And I thought it was the single day because of 'ko', Hindi would be 'ke baad' - I might've realised except the 'baad' still isn't that clear to me.) For whatever it's worth, I concur with that transcription & its translation - I can't find jaanu online but it's so close to Hindi (jaan) that I don't doubt it at all. (It's a hell of a lot easier for me to realise what he's saying when it's written out by someone else, heh.) (I've also vouched for parent comment, it's informative and afaict accurate, I don't understand why it would be dead.)

by OJFord 3y ago

dragonwriter 3y ago

> he switches to Hindi and says similar with 'on the 19th November' (unnis navambar ko) - why would a boycott be so specific Specific date and limited specific location boycotts are a frequently done because they are easier to motivate people for the amount of symbolic impact (because people can rearrange purchases rather than actually cancel them), and because they can prime people for a longer or more general boycott. Its not an uncommon strategy. (People do argue against it because the impacts are largely symbolic, for the same reasons it is easier to organize, and because there is an argument that they can lead to exhaustion -- "I've done the one thing and now you want more" -- more than priming. So there is controversy in the kinds of groups that call for boycotts about them, but, they are still a thing that is done, not an unplausible boycott technique that makes "threat" the only plausible interpretation.)

JumpCrisscross 3y ago

Thank you. Seriously. Do you, in your reading, see a threat? Because I’m not. (Certainly not “that Indira Gandhi Airport will be attacked on November 19th.”) I think it’s dramatically framed to generate clicks. But a lot of right-wing gun crap also sounds like that, and I don’t think they’re always making credible threats. [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dr-gridlock/wp/2017/01/29/uber-triggers-protest-for-not-supporting-taxi-strike-against-refugee-ban/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dr-gridlock/wp/2017/01/2...

OJFord 3y ago
Honestly I don't understand enough to be that confident about it. Maybe I'm naive and too trusting, but personally I took the news org (youth-run or not) sharing it - who presumably do understand it - at face value. I think it's fair to say it's a relatively violent movement - the Wikipedia entry has a section on 'militancy' but not 'peaceful protests' or 'boycotts' for example - but it's not one thing, it's an idea or collection of ideas and there are various groups and factions, so I really don't know anywhere near enough about it - you'd have to take this video in the context of what else this particular guy's said about his own views, rather than what others have done to the same end - in the name of 'khalistan' - really.
sher_e_punjab 3y ago
No his translation is only partial considering he is not a Punjabi. Pannun clearly says "Sikh panthalayo unni november ko baad Air India me safar ni karna. Jaanu khatra ho sagda hai". You can match the timeline in the video from 0:16 to 0:22. Translates to: "Sikh people (panth) don't travel in Air India after 19th November. There will be a threat to your life (Jaanu = Life, khatra = Threat, ho sagda hai = possibility of a threat)" Who will threaten Sikh lives in Air India after 19th November? It is literally reminder of Air India Flight 182 bombings.
- OJFord 3y ago
  Oh so it is Punjabi, I didn't pick up on that sagda (vs. Hindi would be sakta) for example. (And I thought it was the single day because of 'ko', Hindi would be 'ke baad' - I might've realised except the 'baad' still isn't that clear to me.) For whatever it's worth, I concur with that transcription & its translation - I can't find jaanu online but it's so close to Hindi (jaan) that I don't doubt it at all. (It's a hell of a lot easier for me to realise what he's saying when it's written out by someone else, heh.) (I've also vouched for parent comment, it's informative and afaict accurate, I don't understand why it would be dead.)