5 ms·

performance means nothing if the software you require doesn't run on it

nicolaslem 3y ago
We are at a stage where games built for Windows actually run better on Linux so this argument will probably not be relevant for too long anymore.
- Novosell 3y ago
  If they run at all, that is. The latest update to League of Legends seems to have broken it for all Linux users.
  - tyfon 3y ago
    WoW also crashes randomly every 30 minutes using lutris after the latest update, it's quite annoying. This happens on both my wife and my computer. She has an AMD gpu and I have a nvidia. Otherwise it has been running really well.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- uxp8u61q 3y ago
  You mean some games built for Windows run better on Linux (and I'd be curious to know which ones actually run better). Some games barely run on Linux, some just don't work, some get broken by new versions, etc. And computers aren't just for gaming. Some people actually work with their computers. Let me know when photoshop or autocad run smoothly on Linux.
  - heyoni 3y ago
    Cyberpunk runs exactly 3fps lower on NixOS than on windows during benchmarks on ultra, with dlss and ray tracing. Totally negligible performance difference but being on Linux is not.
    - uxp8u61q 3y ago
      Not sure how this is supposed to answer what I wrote, but okay, thanks for the information.
      - heyoni 3y ago
        If a game that runs bleeding edge features on windows can be made to run on Linux, then it’s safe to say that anything can run on Linux. If autocad or photoshop don’t work it’s not because Linux can’t handle it, it’s because the authors of those programs don’t want you to. It’s DRM, every time; not some limitation on what wine can do.
CoastalCoder 3y ago
Do you have particular applications on mind?
- AnimalMuppet 3y ago
  There are a huge number of business-specific Windows-only apps out there, because for so long Windows (and DOS before it) was what everyone ran on. So when you hired some college CS student for three months to create that custom app for your business workflow, it ran on Windows. And it's still there running the business, and so you can't change because that would mean replacing the app. Source code? What's that?
  - CoastalCoder 3y ago
    How is Wine these days for such apps? IIRC, there used to be a problem with .Net and/or Silverlight apps in Wine. But I could be 100% remembering wrong. (I also have no idea if/how Wine supports apps that use ActiveDirectory.)
- acomjean 3y ago
  Anything Adobe falls into that camp saddly.. Luckly fewer and fewer bits of software remain.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
berkes 3y ago
which is why I "need" Linux. The software that I need, will run on Windows, but hardly and always with great effort and abysmal stability. And sometimes not at all. ruby/rbenv, nvm/node, rust/cargo, docker, nvim, ripgrep, git, rsync, ssh. All of which I sometimes, somehow managed to get running at some point when helping co-workers with their Windows machines. But the amount of fiddling, trial-and-errorring and such is terrible. For example PuTTY is a fantastic beast, but it's nowhere near as well integrated and easy to setup and use as SSH on Mac or Linux. If only because the latter already have it. Most was before WSL, though. I presume with WSL it will be much easier. But that's because its running on Linux...
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- baz00 3y ago
  I use a chunk of those. They work absolutely fine on WSL2. My windows machine can quite happily pull shit out of Excel files, into R/Python stack on Linux and squirt them back out into SQL Server with no real cohesion issues. Also I mostly spend all day with VScode open on a Linux box from windows. I also maintain old windows stuff on windows and loads of infra from Linux. It all just works together fine. And it stays working (unlike my 25 year long hate affair with the linux desktop) Oh and I own a Mac as well for when I want to do some shit I actually care about rather than just earn money from.
  - berkes 3y ago
    So you are using Linux. On Windows, sure. But Linux nonetheless.
baz00 3y ago
By your downvotes it looks like the Linux users can't accept that there are superior Windows applications still.
utybo 3y ago
That, and Windows being the only OS with good fractional scaling. My main problem with Linux is that, in order to have tolerable fractional scaling, you have to use tons of hacks to make sure everything is running on Wayland. And even then some basic stuff is just broken, like JetBrains IDEs just not supporting scaling (except on KDE but then other stuff like icons are broken), drag and drop being broken in VS Code, cursors sometimes going absolutely massive, etc. macOS straight up doesn't support fractional scaling, which is even worse (good luck using a 1440p 24" display with it).

We are at a stage where games built for Windows actually run better on Linux so this argument will probably not be relevant for too long anymore.

Novosell 3y ago
If they run at all, that is. The latest update to League of Legends seems to have broken it for all Linux users.
- tyfon 3y ago
  WoW also crashes randomly every 30 minutes using lutris after the latest update, it's quite annoying. This happens on both my wife and my computer. She has an AMD gpu and I have a nvidia. Otherwise it has been running really well.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
uxp8u61q 3y ago
You mean some games built for Windows run better on Linux (and I'd be curious to know which ones actually run better). Some games barely run on Linux, some just don't work, some get broken by new versions, etc. And computers aren't just for gaming. Some people actually work with their computers. Let me know when photoshop or autocad run smoothly on Linux.
- heyoni 3y ago
  Cyberpunk runs exactly 3fps lower on NixOS than on windows during benchmarks on ultra, with dlss and ray tracing. Totally negligible performance difference but being on Linux is not.
  - uxp8u61q 3y ago
    Not sure how this is supposed to answer what I wrote, but okay, thanks for the information.
    - heyoni 3y ago
      If a game that runs bleeding edge features on windows can be made to run on Linux, then it’s safe to say that anything can run on Linux. If autocad or photoshop don’t work it’s not because Linux can’t handle it, it’s because the authors of those programs don’t want you to. It’s DRM, every time; not some limitation on what wine can do.

CoastalCoder 3y ago

Do you have particular applications on mind?

AnimalMuppet 3y ago
There are a huge number of business-specific Windows-only apps out there, because for so long Windows (and DOS before it) was what everyone ran on. So when you hired some college CS student for three months to create that custom app for your business workflow, it ran on Windows. And it's still there running the business, and so you can't change because that would mean replacing the app. Source code? What's that?
- CoastalCoder 3y ago
  How is Wine these days for such apps? IIRC, there used to be a problem with .Net and/or Silverlight apps in Wine. But I could be 100% remembering wrong. (I also have no idea if/how Wine supports apps that use ActiveDirectory.)
acomjean 3y ago
Anything Adobe falls into that camp saddly.. Luckly fewer and fewer bits of software remain.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

berkes 3y ago

which is why I "need" Linux. The software that I need, will run on Windows, but hardly and always with great effort and abysmal stability. And sometimes not at all. ruby/rbenv, nvm/node, rust/cargo, docker, nvim, ripgrep, git, rsync, ssh. All of which I sometimes, somehow managed to get running at some point when helping co-workers with their Windows machines. But the amount of fiddling, trial-and-errorring and such is terrible. For example PuTTY is a fantastic beast, but it's nowhere near as well integrated and easy to setup and use as SSH on Mac or Linux. If only because the latter already have it. Most was before WSL, though. I presume with WSL it will be much easier. But that's because its running on Linux...

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
baz00 3y ago
I use a chunk of those. They work absolutely fine on WSL2. My windows machine can quite happily pull shit out of Excel files, into R/Python stack on Linux and squirt them back out into SQL Server with no real cohesion issues. Also I mostly spend all day with VScode open on a Linux box from windows. I also maintain old windows stuff on windows and loads of infra from Linux. It all just works together fine. And it stays working (unlike my 25 year long hate affair with the linux desktop) Oh and I own a Mac as well for when I want to do some shit I actually care about rather than just earn money from.
- berkes 3y ago
  So you are using Linux. On Windows, sure. But Linux nonetheless.

baz00 3y ago

By your downvotes it looks like the Linux users can't accept that there are superior Windows applications still.

utybo 3y ago

That, and Windows being the only OS with good fractional scaling. My main problem with Linux is that, in order to have tolerable fractional scaling, you have to use tons of hacks to make sure everything is running on Wayland. And even then some basic stuff is just broken, like JetBrains IDEs just not supporting scaling (except on KDE but then other stuff like icons are broken), drag and drop being broken in VS Code, cursors sometimes going absolutely massive, etc. macOS straight up doesn't support fractional scaling, which is even worse (good luck using a 1440p 24" display with it).