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Does this factor in the impact of constant instant-gratification of whatever is done on that screen? Because (subjectively) I can see how children with lots of

Does this factor in the impact of constant instant-gratification of whatever is done on that screen? Because (subjectively) I can see how children with lots of screen-time have a harder time with activities which do not lead to immediate dopamine release, like reading, listening to a story, drawing, etc., while children with low/no screen-time can derive satisfaction already from the process of doing something. -- Edit: I'd say none of this impacts "brain function or well-being" directly, as both CAN do tasks without instant gratification, it's just that children with lots of screen-time perceive them vastly different from my personal observation.

A4ET8a8uTh0 3y ago
This may be the major distinction that is missing. We don't talk about what someone is doing on the screen. Some activities are better than others. Me play Path of Exile -- not great. Reading HN -- potentially not a time sink. Watching a documentary on deadly snakes -- mild time waster. Reading Terry Pratchett for 20x time -- endless joy. edit: I guess my real point is that it is all in the eye of the beholder. I know my parents hated me playing games.
usgroup 3y ago
Children and everyone else … I can’t watch a movie anymore without either reading something or playing chess at the same time just to up the frequency of those hits.
- rickdeckard 3y ago
  Indeed. I guess measurement of your "brain function or well-being" might not show any difference, but the way you perceive those activities might have changed completely. I have a similar observation regarding Movies. Funny how this can be improved by watching a movie in cinema, a purpose of cinema which silently grows while the original purpose of "better audio/video experience" is fading...
  - red-iron-pine 3y ago
    there is James Cameron quote, something to the effect of "a movie ticket is a contract between you and the director that you're going to give this uninterrupted attention"
    - creativenolo 3y ago
      Brilliant. When I buy I physical book, I make a contract between myself and author. But without the third party intermediary (in Cameron’s case, the cinema) screen time sneaks in and invalidates my contractual obligations.
- diplodinkus 3y ago
  But why is that so bad? Movies retell the same story with the same beats over and over again. I think we should be more concerned about people who can focus on something repetitive for extended periods. What's wrong with them?
  - DanHulton 3y ago
    Maybe you should try expanding your cinematic repertoire, if that's the impression you have of movies? I'm saying this genuinely, not to make a snide point or anything. There are some really good movies out there that aren't just "the same beats over and over again." If, say, you're only watching big studio blockbusters, try branching out into smaller dramas, that kind of thing.
    - gspencley 3y ago
      I think what the person you are replying to might be alluding to is "The Seven Basic Plots" theory: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Basic_Plots https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Basic_Plots "Beat for beat" might be a bit unfair but even then there are traditional structures such as "The Hero's Journey" that are commonly used by writer's both in and out of Hollywood. That said, even if structure and a finite number of plots is true, there is still a wide variety of artistic potential from characterization to setting to art style. I will say, however, that the older I get the more "familiar" things feel. Even when I'm watching non-blockbuster stuff. I'm pretty sure this is just the result of having watched more movies throughout my life. My standards are getting higher and my pattern recognition toolset is widening. And since I have dabbled in writing myself, I tend to recognize formulas when they are being applied ... even if the movie is not a cookie-cutter Hollywood factory-produced summer blockbuster.
    - diplodinkus 3y ago
      The last movie I thoroughly enjoyed was (you're going to laugh and I'm OK with that): Hardcore Henry Frenetic, insane, indulgent, madness. Loved it. Can stand most blockbusters, can't stand most dramas.
      - 3y ago
- andsoitis 3y ago
  Two thoughts: - watching a move is screen time - movies aren’t as captivating anymore
- zer00eyz 3y ago
  As someone who doesn't abuse the phone, and mostly works on a computer I have this same issue. It is rare for me to be able to enjoy a movie. Im of the opinion that the quality of content is hot garbage on a good day and actual entertainment is rare now.
  - hotpotamus 3y ago
    I feel this as well (which isn't to say it's true I suppose) about most content, but yes; especially modern movies. It seems like it's nearly all formulaic drivel made to satisfy some algorithm. Of course, it's also possible that's just me getting older - I can imagine some old man making a similar complaint. But I can't help but think there really is something going on. I recently watched Willem Dafoe in "Inside" and while it's not really a cinematic experience that could be called pleasant, I was actually satisfied at the end of it because it actually felt creative.
  - seec 3y ago
    Yeah, I think that's pretty much it. We now have way more content to choose from but the problem now is to be able to select what is worthwhile. They call it attention economy and that's pretty much why. You have limited attention, if you use it on some random crap, you can't use it for something better (that you didn't notice or wasn't as easily accessible). A friend of mine gets pissed off when I fall asleep in front of half the movies, he asks me to watch, but the reality is that those movies are bargain bin low quality comedies (or worse, documentaries) and its better use of my time to sleep than bother with it. It's actually one of my sleeping strategies, to empty my brain of thoughts, so... I don't think there is a major problem with attention, neither in children or adults; it's just that it's a lot harder to sort through what is worth your attention and after some willpower is spent to choose something it doesn't get overthrown because of the psychology of commitment. But it is not worth paying attention, so people use whatever is around them to not completely waste time. In my opinion inattentive children in classrooms has a lot more to do with teachers being bad and lack of physical activities than a problem with the kids. But teachers are politically untouchable nowadays and you can't ask them to actually be competitive or get fired. The pay is also progressive and equal regardless of actual performance, so you get terrible people who cannot keep kids' attention because they suck; but then we blame the kids. Sure.
- Fire-Dragon-DoL 3y ago
  I don't think this is a problem with you, rather with the content. I'm more likely to not do anything else when I rewatch a movie I like then when I watch a new tv show that's average. Some shows are just super slow or full of unnecessary stuff and they try to sell those portions as "art"

A4ET8a8uTh0 3y ago

This may be the major distinction that is missing. We don't talk about what someone is doing on the screen. Some activities are better than others. Me play Path of Exile -- not great. Reading HN -- potentially not a time sink. Watching a documentary on deadly snakes -- mild time waster. Reading Terry Pratchett for 20x time -- endless joy. edit: I guess my real point is that it is all in the eye of the beholder. I know my parents hated me playing games.

usgroup 3y ago

Children and everyone else … I can’t watch a movie anymore without either reading something or playing chess at the same time just to up the frequency of those hits.

rickdeckard 3y ago
Indeed. I guess measurement of your "brain function or well-being" might not show any difference, but the way you perceive those activities might have changed completely. I have a similar observation regarding Movies. Funny how this can be improved by watching a movie in cinema, a purpose of cinema which silently grows while the original purpose of "better audio/video experience" is fading...
- red-iron-pine 3y ago
  there is James Cameron quote, something to the effect of "a movie ticket is a contract between you and the director that you're going to give this uninterrupted attention"
  - creativenolo 3y ago
    Brilliant. When I buy I physical book, I make a contract between myself and author. But without the third party intermediary (in Cameron’s case, the cinema) screen time sneaks in and invalidates my contractual obligations.
diplodinkus 3y ago
But why is that so bad? Movies retell the same story with the same beats over and over again. I think we should be more concerned about people who can focus on something repetitive for extended periods. What's wrong with them?
- DanHulton 3y ago
  Maybe you should try expanding your cinematic repertoire, if that's the impression you have of movies? I'm saying this genuinely, not to make a snide point or anything. There are some really good movies out there that aren't just "the same beats over and over again." If, say, you're only watching big studio blockbusters, try branching out into smaller dramas, that kind of thing.
  - gspencley 3y ago
    I think what the person you are replying to might be alluding to is "The Seven Basic Plots" theory: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Basic_Plots https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Basic_Plots "Beat for beat" might be a bit unfair but even then there are traditional structures such as "The Hero's Journey" that are commonly used by writer's both in and out of Hollywood. That said, even if structure and a finite number of plots is true, there is still a wide variety of artistic potential from characterization to setting to art style. I will say, however, that the older I get the more "familiar" things feel. Even when I'm watching non-blockbuster stuff. I'm pretty sure this is just the result of having watched more movies throughout my life. My standards are getting higher and my pattern recognition toolset is widening. And since I have dabbled in writing myself, I tend to recognize formulas when they are being applied ... even if the movie is not a cookie-cutter Hollywood factory-produced summer blockbuster.
  - diplodinkus 3y ago
    The last movie I thoroughly enjoyed was (you're going to laugh and I'm OK with that): Hardcore Henry Frenetic, insane, indulgent, madness. Loved it. Can stand most blockbusters, can't stand most dramas.
    - 3y ago
andsoitis 3y ago
Two thoughts: - watching a move is screen time - movies aren’t as captivating anymore
zer00eyz 3y ago
As someone who doesn't abuse the phone, and mostly works on a computer I have this same issue. It is rare for me to be able to enjoy a movie. Im of the opinion that the quality of content is hot garbage on a good day and actual entertainment is rare now.
- hotpotamus 3y ago
  I feel this as well (which isn't to say it's true I suppose) about most content, but yes; especially modern movies. It seems like it's nearly all formulaic drivel made to satisfy some algorithm. Of course, it's also possible that's just me getting older - I can imagine some old man making a similar complaint. But I can't help but think there really is something going on. I recently watched Willem Dafoe in "Inside" and while it's not really a cinematic experience that could be called pleasant, I was actually satisfied at the end of it because it actually felt creative.
- seec 3y ago
  Yeah, I think that's pretty much it. We now have way more content to choose from but the problem now is to be able to select what is worthwhile. They call it attention economy and that's pretty much why. You have limited attention, if you use it on some random crap, you can't use it for something better (that you didn't notice or wasn't as easily accessible). A friend of mine gets pissed off when I fall asleep in front of half the movies, he asks me to watch, but the reality is that those movies are bargain bin low quality comedies (or worse, documentaries) and its better use of my time to sleep than bother with it. It's actually one of my sleeping strategies, to empty my brain of thoughts, so... I don't think there is a major problem with attention, neither in children or adults; it's just that it's a lot harder to sort through what is worth your attention and after some willpower is spent to choose something it doesn't get overthrown because of the psychology of commitment. But it is not worth paying attention, so people use whatever is around them to not completely waste time. In my opinion inattentive children in classrooms has a lot more to do with teachers being bad and lack of physical activities than a problem with the kids. But teachers are politically untouchable nowadays and you can't ask them to actually be competitive or get fired. The pay is also progressive and equal regardless of actual performance, so you get terrible people who cannot keep kids' attention because they suck; but then we blame the kids. Sure.
Fire-Dragon-DoL 3y ago
I don't think this is a problem with you, rather with the content. I'm more likely to not do anything else when I rewatch a movie I like then when I watch a new tv show that's average. Some shows are just super slow or full of unnecessary stuff and they try to sell those portions as "art"