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"that the process and communications around Sam’s removal has been handled very badly" The communication was bad (sudden Friday message about not being candid)

by ah765 3y ago

"that the process and communications around Sam’s removal has been handled very badly" The communication was bad (sudden Friday message about not being candid) but he doesn't mention the reason is bad. "Before I took the job, I checked on the reasoning behind the change. The board did not remove Sam over any specific disagreement on safety, their reasoning was completely different from that. I'm not crazy enough to take this job without board support for commercializing our awesome models." He knows the reason, it's not safety, but he's not allowed to say what it is. Given that, I think that the reason may not be petty, though it's still unclear what it is. It's interesting that he thinks it will take more than a month to figure things out, needing an investigator and interviews with many people. It sounds like perhaps there is a core dysfunction in the company that is part of the reason for the ouster.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
icelancer 3y ago
I think 30 days is pretty reasonable. He can't guarantee a statement by Black Friday or anything. Besides, he isn't bound to release it in 30 days. He could very well have something within 10 days. But he just got the job and I'm sure many people are on PTO/leave for holidays. Give the guy some time. (And this is coming from someone who is pretty bearish on OpenAI going forward, just think it's fair to Shear)
- ah765 3y ago
  It's important because right now everyone, OpenAI employees included, has no idea why Sam Altman was fired. And now we're being told that we may or may not hear the reason in 30 days. What could the reason be that would justify this kind of wait? I'll point out that Sam also doesn't seem to want to say the reason (possibly he's legally forbidden?). And all of the people following him out of OpenAI don't know, and are simply trusting him enough to be willing to leave without knowing.
  - icelancer 3y ago
    Satya and gdb know. I would guess most of management/leadership that followed him also know.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - peteradio 3y ago
      No kidding, clearly they were being poached and were not being open about it in spite of their sensitive positions in OpenAI.
  - jeffrallen 3y ago
    If you work for OpenAI and care what the reason is, assume you need to find a new job. If you are a customer, arrange to use alternative services. (It's always a good idea to not count one flaky vendor with a habit of outages and firing CEOs.) If you are just eating popcorn, me too, pass the bowl.
PKop 3y ago
>it's not safety Can you explain what is meant by the word safety? Many are mentioning this term but it's not clear what is the specific definition in this context. And then what would someone get fired over relating to it?
- ubercore 3y ago
  In this context, I believe it's safety of releasing AI tools, and the impact they may have on society or unintentional harm they may cause.
- tsimionescu 3y ago
  In this context, this is about the idea of AI safety. This can either refer to the more short-term concerns about AI helping to spread misinformation (e.g. ChatGPT being used to churn out massive amounts of fake news) or implicit biases (e.g. "predictive policing" using AI to analyze crime data that ends up incarcerating minorities because of accidental biases in its training set). Or it can refer to the longer term fears about a super-human intelligence that would end up acting against humanity for various reasons, and efforts to create a super-human AI that would have the same moral goals as us (and the fear that a non-safe AGI could be accidentally created). In this specific conversation, one of the proposed scenarios is that Ilya Sutskever wanted to focus OpenAI more on AI safety at the possible detriment of fast advancements towards intelligence, and at the detriment of commercialization; while Sam Altman wants to prioritize the other two over excessive safety concerns. The new CEO is stating that this is not the core reason why the board took their decision.
- treprinum 3y ago
  "User: How to make an atomic bomb for $100?" "AI: I am sorry, I can't provide this information."
  - the_lonely_road 3y ago
    user: How to make a White Russian? AI: I’m sorry due to the ongoing conflict we currently don’t provide information related to Russia. (You have been docked one social point for use of the following forbidden words: “White). Or maybe more dystopian… AI: Our file on you suggests you may have recently become pregnant and therefore cannot provide you information on alcohol products. CPS has been notified of your query.
DebtDeflation 3y ago
>I think that the reason may not be petty, though it's still unclear what it is The best explanation I've seen is that Ilya is ok with commercializing the models themselves to fund AGI research but that the announcement of an app store for Laundry Buddy type "GPTs" at Dev Day was a bridge too far.

by ah765 3y ago

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

icelancer 3y ago

I think 30 days is pretty reasonable. He can't guarantee a statement by Black Friday or anything. Besides, he isn't bound to release it in 30 days. He could very well have something within 10 days. But he just got the job and I'm sure many people are on PTO/leave for holidays. Give the guy some time. (And this is coming from someone who is pretty bearish on OpenAI going forward, just think it's fair to Shear)

ah765 3y ago
It's important because right now everyone, OpenAI employees included, has no idea why Sam Altman was fired. And now we're being told that we may or may not hear the reason in 30 days. What could the reason be that would justify this kind of wait? I'll point out that Sam also doesn't seem to want to say the reason (possibly he's legally forbidden?). And all of the people following him out of OpenAI don't know, and are simply trusting him enough to be willing to leave without knowing.
- icelancer 3y ago
  Satya and gdb know. I would guess most of management/leadership that followed him also know.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - peteradio 3y ago
    No kidding, clearly they were being poached and were not being open about it in spite of their sensitive positions in OpenAI.
- jeffrallen 3y ago
  If you work for OpenAI and care what the reason is, assume you need to find a new job. If you are a customer, arrange to use alternative services. (It's always a good idea to not count one flaky vendor with a habit of outages and firing CEOs.) If you are just eating popcorn, me too, pass the bowl.

PKop 3y ago

>it's not safety Can you explain what is meant by the word safety? Many are mentioning this term but it's not clear what is the specific definition in this context. And then what would someone get fired over relating to it?

ubercore 3y ago
In this context, I believe it's safety of releasing AI tools, and the impact they may have on society or unintentional harm they may cause.
tsimionescu 3y ago
In this context, this is about the idea of AI safety. This can either refer to the more short-term concerns about AI helping to spread misinformation (e.g. ChatGPT being used to churn out massive amounts of fake news) or implicit biases (e.g. "predictive policing" using AI to analyze crime data that ends up incarcerating minorities because of accidental biases in its training set). Or it can refer to the longer term fears about a super-human intelligence that would end up acting against humanity for various reasons, and efforts to create a super-human AI that would have the same moral goals as us (and the fear that a non-safe AGI could be accidentally created). In this specific conversation, one of the proposed scenarios is that Ilya Sutskever wanted to focus OpenAI more on AI safety at the possible detriment of fast advancements towards intelligence, and at the detriment of commercialization; while Sam Altman wants to prioritize the other two over excessive safety concerns. The new CEO is stating that this is not the core reason why the board took their decision.
treprinum 3y ago
"User: How to make an atomic bomb for $100?" "AI: I am sorry, I can't provide this information."
- the_lonely_road 3y ago
  user: How to make a White Russian? AI: I’m sorry due to the ongoing conflict we currently don’t provide information related to Russia. (You have been docked one social point for use of the following forbidden words: “White). Or maybe more dystopian… AI: Our file on you suggests you may have recently become pregnant and therefore cannot provide you information on alcohol products. CPS has been notified of your query.

DebtDeflation 3y ago

>I think that the reason may not be petty, though it's still unclear what it is The best explanation I've seen is that Ilya is ok with commercializing the models themselves to fund AGI research but that the announcement of an app store for Laundry Buddy type "GPTs" at Dev Day was a bridge too far.