3 ms·

99% of the time I'm with 2 side-by-side editor panes open, so horizontal estate is very precious in this case, otherwise both documents won't fit well. That's

by j1elo 3y ago

99% of the time I'm with 2 side-by-side editor panes open, so horizontal estate is very precious in this case, otherwise both documents won't fit well. That's also why I'm thankful when people don't assume 16:9 screen estate and configure their max line length to huge amounts like 120 or more! 80, 100 max, is still today the sweet spot. But I digress. For an IDE I wouldn't use vertical tabs on a side. But for web browsing they've become second nature to me, and Tree Style Tab for Firefox [1] changed the way I use the browser! [1]: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/tree-style-tab/ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/tree-style-ta...

kdwikzncba 3y ago
Similarly, I use 3 side by side editor panes, and 90 is about the max I can see.
DonHopkins 3y ago
This is why you should be able to choose which side and position any tab is positioned along any window at any time, and change them at any time by dragging them to where you want. Then you can assign meanings to each side, depending on your workflow, for example (this should be under user control, not set in stone, of course): Tabs on the top for important stuff. Tabs on the bottom for administrative stuff. Tabs on left for things you haven't read yet. Tabs on right for things you've already read. Then drag the tab from the left to the right after you read something (like moving it from your "in box" to your "out box"), or pin its tab on the top or bottom of it's important and you want to keep it around and easy to find. And if you really want, you should be able to hide the tab to save space. And not only tabs for apps like browser and IDEs, but also the desktop window manager should support tabs on top level windows in a consistent manner, so you can drag tabbed windows in and out of other window frames, as well as arranging them in hierarchical outlines along the edges. All this is super obvious, and saves a lot of time and effort, so it bewilders me why tabs like I described and implemented in the 1980's aren't universally supported on all desktops and applications by now. It's not because they're patented. Adobe tried, and sued Macromedia over it, but that patent (illegitimate in my view, since it ignored the prior art, and was extremely obvious and not patentable) has long since expired. https://www.metafilter.com/2805/Adobe-sues-Macromedia-over-infringement-of-their-patented-tabbed-palettes https://www.metafilter.com/2805/Adobe-sues-Macromedia-over-i...
- j1elo 3y ago
  I think one reason might be something similar (just in spirit, not the concrete concept itself) of another good idea killed by patents, in a whole different domain that was talked about in HN some days ago: mini-games that would appear during the loading screens of the actual game on a console. Bandai-Namco had a patent for that, thus it killed spread in other games. Maybe both these are cases of good ideas that were there at the right time and place, but lost steam because of patents, and then later the timing was just too late already. In the case of games, loading screens are nowhere as lengthy as they were when the mini game idea would have been useful. Similarly, the all-tabs paradigm would nowadays be way out of scope for commercial desktop environment makers, who are deeply immersed in a crusade to make simpler and mobile-compatible UIs for their systems, and have been so, slowly but surely, for at least the last decade. EDIT: albeit if the idea had been around since the 80's, then my reasoning doesn't hold water! 90's was the age of multi-document UIs on Windows, and I'd argue that was the best time the idea had to get some implementations, but I guess it didn't get too much popularity back then either, or maybe Microsoft evaluated and didn't bet on it.
bicx 3y ago
I used to set max line length on my projects to 120. However, I now live off-grid and primarily work from my 14” MBP. At this level, 80-100 really is the sweet spot, particularly with side-by-side or just a couple levels of sidebar.

by j1elo 3y ago

kdwikzncba 3y ago

Similarly, I use 3 side by side editor panes, and 90 is about the max I can see.

DonHopkins 3y ago

This is why you should be able to choose which side and position any tab is positioned along any window at any time, and change them at any time by dragging them to where you want. Then you can assign meanings to each side, depending on your workflow, for example (this should be under user control, not set in stone, of course): Tabs on the top for important stuff. Tabs on the bottom for administrative stuff. Tabs on left for things you haven't read yet. Tabs on right for things you've already read. Then drag the tab from the left to the right after you read something (like moving it from your "in box" to your "out box"), or pin its tab on the top or bottom of it's important and you want to keep it around and easy to find. And if you really want, you should be able to hide the tab to save space. And not only tabs for apps like browser and IDEs, but also the desktop window manager should support tabs on top level windows in a consistent manner, so you can drag tabbed windows in and out of other window frames, as well as arranging them in hierarchical outlines along the edges. All this is super obvious, and saves a lot of time and effort, so it bewilders me why tabs like I described and implemented in the 1980's aren't universally supported on all desktops and applications by now. It's not because they're patented. Adobe tried, and sued Macromedia over it, but that patent (illegitimate in my view, since it ignored the prior art, and was extremely obvious and not patentable) has long since expired. https://www.metafilter.com/2805/Adobe-sues-Macromedia-over-infringement-of-their-patented-tabbed-palettes https://www.metafilter.com/2805/Adobe-sues-Macromedia-over-i...

j1elo 3y ago
I think one reason might be something similar (just in spirit, not the concrete concept itself) of another good idea killed by patents, in a whole different domain that was talked about in HN some days ago: mini-games that would appear during the loading screens of the actual game on a console. Bandai-Namco had a patent for that, thus it killed spread in other games. Maybe both these are cases of good ideas that were there at the right time and place, but lost steam because of patents, and then later the timing was just too late already. In the case of games, loading screens are nowhere as lengthy as they were when the mini game idea would have been useful. Similarly, the all-tabs paradigm would nowadays be way out of scope for commercial desktop environment makers, who are deeply immersed in a crusade to make simpler and mobile-compatible UIs for their systems, and have been so, slowly but surely, for at least the last decade. EDIT: albeit if the idea had been around since the 80's, then my reasoning doesn't hold water! 90's was the age of multi-document UIs on Windows, and I'd argue that was the best time the idea had to get some implementations, but I guess it didn't get too much popularity back then either, or maybe Microsoft evaluated and didn't bet on it.

bicx 3y ago

I used to set max line length on my projects to 120. However, I now live off-grid and primarily work from my 14” MBP. At this level, 80-100 really is the sweet spot, particularly with side-by-side or just a couple levels of sidebar.